Author Topic: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy  (Read 7499 times)

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Offline Severous

Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« on: August 06, 2009, 08:02:40 PM »
My people need Beer!

Pak.German V102

When my game started in 1876 there was 1 hop field, 1 brewery, and 1 marketplace.  These are three of the four parts for the Beer making industry.  Whats missing is Barley.  There was no Barley in the initial game spawn.

Ive played for 7 years and this incomplete industry chain has not been altered by Simutrans in any way.  I had hoped the game would spawn the missing Barley industry..or logically close down the unproductive industry.  But no..nothing had happened to any industry..until tonight.



A new industry chain. 2 industries at the largest town which had recently passed 3000 Population (a 3000 trigger perhaps?).  Great I thought.  Maybe its the missing Barley so I can Brew some Beer at last.  Ive got plenty of Hops stored near the Brewery...just need the Barley.

Then the disbelief.  Another Brewery and another Marketplace.  I don't need either.  Why has Simutrans spawned another incomplete chain?

Is this a design floor in the game engine, or a gap/bug in the Pak design?  Either way I'm gutted and really thirsty.  Theres only so much wine and water I can drink before I need a Beer.

Any thoughts?
Regards
Sev.

Offline Frank

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2009, 08:40:19 PM »
for factory data see german wiki

Offline Severous

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2009, 07:38:01 AM »
Thanks Frank

Barley = Gerstenhof.  If I am understanding the wiki correctly its supposed to be available. 

I remain puzzelled and frustrated with the whole Simutrans industrial experience.
Regards
Sev.

Offline sanna

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2009, 07:11:02 PM »
I have had the same problem myself, but upgrading the pak.german pakset helped. It seems the "Gerstenhof" can only be built on Tundra (not sure why....for me tundra is where NOTHING grows...). Could it possibly be that you have no sufficiently large area of Tundra to house a Gerstenhof? Not that it is very easy to figure out what climate a specific piece of terrain has... When I try myself with 8% tundra, I consistently get long lines like
Code: [Select]
Message: fabrikbauer_t::baue_hierarchie: failed to built lieferant Gerstenhof around (-139,225) r=0 for Klosterbrauerei.  and I have never seen one  be built during map generation - nor have I been able to force build one myself (as public player) except by explicitly ignoring climate information.
The "Bauernhof" available from Ver. 0.103 however can be built on other climates - and this is the one I get when I do get a working beer chain. It seems like upgrading the pakset is your best option...

Offline Frank

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2009, 07:36:21 PM »
The paper mill on start map is ground tundra.

Offline Severous

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2009, 08:22:17 AM »
Hi

Sorry for the delay with my response to the above replies (been away on holiday).

In the German wiki link that Frank provided, I reasoned that white colour meant the industry was available for that terrain.  The oil rig for instance is coloured white and available.  So I had assumed the Barley field should be available everywhere except tundra.

But..sanna..you are into the understanding of the game better than I and you have tried to resolve this. So Barley should only appear in tundra?    Doesn't seem logical.

You are right about my map.  Its a map of Germany downloaded from a map site. Ive used it unaltered. It is quite flat.  No tundra that I can see.

Frank..Is Barley provided by a Gerstenhof? Should we be able to have Barley in V102?

Regards
Sev.

Offline sanna

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2009, 10:15:14 AM »
But..sanna..you are into the understanding of the game better than I and you have tried to resolve this. So Barley should only appear in tundra?    Doesn't seem logical.
Severous: The best and most authorative way to check were various types of industry can appear is to use the game itself. That way you can be sure that the information you get is the one from the pakset and version of it you are using.

To do this (in pak.german other paksets solve it differently - and sorry if you have already figured this out and I am being too detailed) use the Special tool button, and change to Public player (the P+ button). Then a new button appears furthest to the right under the Special toolbar that allows you to manually edit the map - and it does also allow you to see the specifications of each building. Click this new menu button to open up the map edit tool bar. On the map edit tool bar is a button to build industries - click it and you get a dialogue with all the industries that can be built with the current pakset. Locate the Gerstenhof (the Object tab shows the industries by their pak name) and select it in the list. To the right appears information about the industry -- for me it shows that the only possible climate zone for Gerstenhof is Tundra - as I hinted before, I do not know _why_ it is set to that value. In the version of the pakset I have, there are however also a set of Bauernhof (1-5) which may be built in other climates.

Once you are done checking, dont forget to use the P+ button to change back to being the player *smile*

Offline Frank

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2009, 01:07:22 PM »
....
Frank..Is Barley provided by a Gerstenhof? Should we be able to have Barley in V102?
...

Bauernhof and Gerstenhof produce Barley

Offline Severous

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2009, 04:29:49 PM »
Thanks for the replies.

I disabled player change in my game.  So I instead started a new one and allowed player change. Followed your guidance and sure enough in v102 Tundra is the only terrain suitable for a Barley farm.  So it seems my game is stuck with incomplete hop/brewery chains for now.
Regards
Sev.

Offline Frank

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2009, 05:48:12 PM »
please tested new files

new_Barley_industry.zip 164 kb

Offline Severous

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2009, 10:42:48 PM »
Hello Frank

Thank you for the new files.  Ive put them into V102 pak.German and ran some tests.

1) Set up new game.(twice).  Both times I had spawns of the new hop producing industries.  On no occassion did the Barley Field (renamed in the new file) appear. That remains limited to Tundra terrain.


2) My existing save game ran without any crashes.

3) Existing save game put on fast forward 11 years.  Some new industry chains appeared but no Barley.  Not yet.

Question: I am on fast forward and have not connectted any of the new industries that have appeared.  Will this prevent further new industries from appearing?

Observation: some of the industries have names that start with lower case.  The industry listing is case sensitive. See screenshot above. Could all industries be named with a capital letter first so they sort correctly. (or sort made not case sensitive)
« Last Edit: August 17, 2009, 10:47:45 PM by Severous »
Regards
Sev.

Offline Dwachs

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Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2009, 05:06:38 AM »
1) Set up new game.(twice).  Both times I had spawns of the new hop producing industries.  On no occassion did the Barley Field (renamed in the new file) appear. That remains limited to Tundra terrain.
The brewery in your screenshot shows three connected farms, which should supply barley.
Parsley, sage, rosemary, and maggikraut.

Offline Severous

Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2009, 06:10:21 AM »
Yes they did produce Barley.  Hops and Barley.  Sorry..I had meant to say Barley in the above post.  Everything looked right to produce Beer.  Good job.

Questions on game mechanics now. 
a) If I continue to grow towns will more industry spawn despite the fact that I am not connecting any of it?
b) Do you expect those new files to work on my existing saved game?
Regards
Sev.

Offline Dwachs

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Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2009, 08:11:37 AM »
Questions on game mechanics now. 
a) If I continue to grow towns will more industry spawn despite the fact that I am not connecting any of it?
yes, but you can turn it off by setting the parameter 'industry_increase_every' to zero in pakxyz/cityrules.tab, but I am not sure whether this works for already started games.
Parsley, sage, rosemary, and maggikraut.

Offline Combuijs

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Re: Pak.German - No Barley means no Beer..most unhappy
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2009, 10:01:49 AM »
Quote
but I am not sure whether this works for already started games

This parameter works indeed for already started games. It's not saved in the game itself, it's always runtime.
Bob Marley: No woman, no cry

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