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Author Topic: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints  (Read 367 times)

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Offline Vladki cz

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LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« on: February 05, 2019, 10:15:06 PM »
There is an inconsistency in naming. All LNWR-8wheelers have a constraint reference to LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-front but there is no such vehicle. There is NWR-8wheel-radial-brake. Also it is written to have an upgrade to LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav but LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-front exists. I thinkt the LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake should be renamed to LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-front, and the upgrade reference fixed:
Code: [Select]
diff --git a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
index b8111fd78..81f582697 100644
--- a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
+++ b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
@@ -1,7 +1,7 @@
 # D352
 # See Jenkinson (LNWR) p. 110
 obj=vehicle
-name=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake
+name=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-front
 speed=135
 copyright=Kieron/James
 intro_year=1883
@@ -23,7 +23,7 @@ cost=340000
 runningcost=0
 fixed_cost=5205
 
-upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav
+upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-front
 upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake
 
 comfort[0]=0

Offline jamespetts gb

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2019, 11:38:24 PM »
Thank you for spotting those errors: now fixed.

Offline Vladki cz

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2019, 09:13:44 PM »
Thank you for fixing.

EDIT:
one more fix in the upgrade path for these carriages:
Code: [Select]
diff --git a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
index b8111fd78..2bd7d8381 100644
--- a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
+++ b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
@@ -1,7 +1,7 @@
 # D352
 # See Jenkinson (LNWR) p. 110
 obj=vehicle
-name=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake
+name=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-front
 speed=135
 copyright=Kieron/James
 intro_year=1883
@@ -23,8 +23,8 @@ cost=340000
 runningcost=0
 fixed_cost=5205
 
-upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav
-upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake
+upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-front
+upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake-front
 
 comfort[0]=0
 comfort[1]=63

« Last Edit: February 11, 2019, 09:40:03 PM by Vladki »

Offline jamespetts gb

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2019, 10:22:27 PM »
I am afraid that I cannot find any entry in the form:

Code: [Select]
upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav

Are you sure that you have the up to date version of the pakset sources?

Offline Vladki cz

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2019, 11:25:51 PM »
Yeah I was a few commits behind. Here is the new patch:

Code: [Select]
diff --git a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
index 8d1ebbb5b..39bbc08dd 100644
--- a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
+++ b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
@@ -24,8 +24,7 @@
 runningcost=0
 fixed_cost=5205
 
 upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-front
-upgrade[1]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-rear
-upgrade[2]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake
+upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake-front
 
 comfort[0]=0
 comfort[1]=63

Offline jamespetts gb

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2019, 11:34:05 PM »
Thank you - now fixed.

Offline Vladki cz

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2019, 03:34:37 PM »
Further inconsistencies in LNWR-8wheel-radial to LNWR-bogey (42ft-non-cor) upgrades

Code: [Select]
diff --git a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
index 39bbc08dd..5332aa033 100644
--- a/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
+++ b/trains/lnwr-8wheel-radials.dat
@@ -497,7 +497,7 @@ fixed_cost=633
 cost=530000
 
 # TODO: Allow these to upgrade to the correct class once the classed vehicles become available.
-upgrade[0]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-lav
+upgrade[0]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-lav-first
 
 comfort[0]=0
 comfort[1]=70
@@ -1103,7 +1103,7 @@ fixed_cost=405
 
 upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav-tricomposite
 # TODO: Upgrade these to the correct types when these are produced.
-upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav
+upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav-composite
 
 comfort[0]=0
 comfort[1]=63

There are upgrades of 8-wheel radial (non-lav) to bogey (non-lav) or radial+lavatory. And then from radial+lavatory to bogey+lavatory, but there are no upgrades form bogey non-lav to bogey+lav. Is that intended? There is one extra upgrade of name=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake-rear to =LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-rear, which is imho just wrong (add lavatory, but replace the underframe for older type?)

Code: [Select]
diff --git a/trains/lnwr-42ft-non-cor.dat b/trains/lnwr-42ft-non-cor.dat
index 889f22100..65faa72e2 100644
--- a/trains/lnwr-42ft-non-cor.dat
+++ b/trains/lnwr-42ft-non-cor.dat
@@ -1462,8 +1462,6 @@ upgrade_price=12000
 runningcost=0
 fixed_cost=5217
 
-upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-rear
-
 comfort[0]=0
 comfort[1]=66
 comfort[2]=76

EDIT:
further inconsistencies are in description texts:
- 8wheel radial first class is 5+1/2 compartments (capacity 33), but the bogey upgrade with same capacity is described as 6-compartment.
- there is no lnwr-42ft-non-cor-tpo. the radial TPO can be upgraded to plain mail. The radial TPO has the same capacity as plain mail. Is that intended?

I have a question how did the conversion to lavatory carriages go? These seem to have no corridor, so I guess there must have been a lavatory (perhaps in size of smaller compartment) shared by two  compartments? The capacity of compartments would be slightly reduced (maybe one or two seats?) to make place for the door to the lavatory. So, probable upgrades would be:
7-compartment 3rd (7x10) -> 6-compartment+lav 3rd (6x9=54, 6x8=48), but we have 56, that is 2x8+4x10 - so only two compartments with lavatory, and 4 without?
4-compartment 3rd brake (4x10) -> 3 compartment 3rd brake+lav (3x8=24). (but we have only 22). Maybe should be even 26, if one compartment was without lavatory.
5.5 compartment 1st (5.5x6=33) -> 5 compartment 1st (5x5=25), or 26 if one compartment is without lav, or should be only 4 compartments (4x5=20). (we have capacity 23 = 4x5 + 3 = 4.5 compartments ?)
7-compartment composite 2/3 (2+5)x10 -> 4.5 compartment tricomposite: 2x5 (2x1st) + 1x4 (half x 2nd) + 2x8 (3rd) - that matches the dat file...

So maybe the descriptions should be changed this way:
Code: [Select]
diff --git a/text/en.tab b/text/en.tab
index 47fea609a..9b4d10bf5 100644
--- a/text/en.tab
+++ b/text/en.tab
@@ -5833,11 +5833,11 @@ LNWR eight wheel (radial) seven compartment composite carriage (second/third cla
 LNWR-8wheel-radial-non-lav-first
 LNWR eight wheel (radial) five and a half compartment carriage (first class)
 LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav
-LNWR eight wheel (radial) four and a half compartment lavatory tricomposite carriage (first/second/third class)
+LNWR eight wheel (radial) six compartment lavatory carriage (third class)
 LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav-first
-LNWR eight wheel (radial) five compartment lavatory carriage (first class)
+LNWR eight wheel (radial) four and a half compartment lavatory carriage (first class)
 LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav-tricomposite
-LNWR eight wheel (radial) five compartment lavatory carriage (first class)
+LNWR eight wheel (radial) four and a half compartment lavatory tricomposite carriage (first/second/third class)
 LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-rear
 LNWR eight wheel (radial) four compartment brake (third class)
 LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake-lav-rear
@@ -5855,13 +5855,13 @@ LNWR three compartment lavatory bogie brake carriage (42ft) (third class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-lav
 LNWR six compartment lavatory bogie carriage (42ft) (third class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-lav-first
-LNWR five and a half compartment lavatory bogie carriage (42ft) (first class)
+LNWR four and a half compartment lavatory bogie carriage (42ft) (first class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-lav-tricomposite
-LNWR six compartment lavatory bogie tricomposite carriage (42ft) (first/second/third class)
+LNWR four and a half compartment lavatory bogie tricomposite carriage (42ft) (first/second/third class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav
 LNWR seven compartment bogie carriage (42ft) (third class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav-first
-LNWR six compartment bogie carriage (42ft) (first class)
+LNWR five and a half compartment bogie carriage (42ft) (first class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav-composite
 LNWR seven compartment bogie composite carriage (42ft) (second/third class)
 LNWR-42ft-non-cor-brake-rear
« Last Edit: February 17, 2019, 09:07:07 PM by Vladki »

Offline jamespetts gb

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2019, 01:01:08 AM »
Thank you for that: I have fixed the identified anomalies.

As to the lavatory upgrades, these are somewhat complex, as how lavatories were laid out varied from vehicle to vehicle. I am basing the carriages in the pakset on those that existed in reality documented in a book about LNWR carriages which I have, so it is probably better not to speculate about what might have existed.

Offline Vladki cz

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2019, 01:57:59 AM »
Could you then sum up somewhere how the upgrades were done?
I was just trying to find out how the number of compartments and seats add up, and got quite confused.

EDIT:

I have chacked the last update, I see you have missed the upgrade from 8-wheel-radial-composite to 42ft-non-cor-non-lav-composite.
I assume that at least the radial to bogey upgrades were quite straightforward...

Code: [Select]
@@ -1103,7 +1103,7 @@
fixed_cost=405
 
 upgrade[0]=LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav-tricomposite
 # TODO: Upgrade these to the correct types when these are produced.
-upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav
+upgrade[1]=LNWR-42ft-non-cor-non-lav-composite
 
 comfort[0]=0
 comfort[1]=63


EDIT2:

regarding the descriptions on lavatory carriages. I do not want to argue about the number of compartments, you should be able to check them in the book, but at least the class and composite informations should match.
So please at least these descriptions should be fixed:   (tricomposite is wrongly described as 1st clas, and 3rd class is described as tricomposite.)

Code: [Select]
LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav
-LNWR eight wheel (radial) four and a half compartment lavatory tricomposite carriage (first/second/third class)
+LNWR eight wheel (radial) six compartment lavatory carriage (third class)

 LNWR-8wheel-radial-lav-tricomposite
-LNWR eight wheel (radial) five compartment lavatory carriage (first class)
+LNWR eight wheel (radial) four and a half compartment lavatory tricomposite carriage (first/second/third class)

Otherwise the upgrade path radial-non-lav -> radial-lav -> bogey-lav, seems to be OK. Just wondering if there should be upgrade from bogey-non-lav to bogey-lav ?
« Last Edit: February 23, 2019, 12:55:01 PM by Vladki »

Offline jamespetts gb

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Re: LNWR-8wheel-radial-brake inconsistency in constraints
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2019, 11:50:50 PM »
Thank you for spotting these errors: I believe that these are now fixed.