Started by 1993matias, April 02, 2020, 10:13:51 AM
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Quote from: Vladki on April 10, 2020, 08:01:49 PMI have seen something similar happening both in standard and extended, with incomplete paksets - pak128.cs and pak128.sweden.Is it possible, just by chance that there are no suitable low level buildings for the current year and climate, where the towns are built?
Quote from: 1993matias on April 11, 2020, 11:33:54 AMDoes the Simuconf.tab in *\Simutrans\config have any influence on Simutrans-Ex?
Quote from: Vladki on April 11, 2020, 04:57:58 PMSure it does. If you play sometimes standard and sometimes extended, I recommend having separate directories, e.g. ~/simutrans-std and ~/simutrans-ext, and add ~/simutrans as symlink to what you currently play.
QuoteEspecially during the 1960s-80s, this actually causes the population to decrease because residential buildings are renovated into those with a smaller population.
// Divide unemployed by 4, because it counts towards commercial and industrial, // and both of those count 'double' for population relative to residential. int employment_wanted = get_unemployed()*2;
Quote from: Ranran on January 08, 2021, 01:11:32 PMAs I've already pointed out, this is just an expectation of chance. Perhaps even in those times, condominiums are more densely populated than small houses.
Quote from: freddyhayward on January 08, 2021, 02:02:27 PMThere is a specific residential building with 30 people defined at a higher level than buildings with 150 people.
Quote from: jamespetts on January 08, 2021, 03:25:40 PMHowever, at this stage, if there is a way of fixing the reported bug quickly and easily without fundamentally unbalancing the game, then this would be welcome.
// Divide unemployed by 4, because it counts towards commercial and industrial, // and both of those count 'double' for population relative to residential. int employment_wanted = get_unemployed()*4;
Quote from: Ranran on January 08, 2021, 02:30:32 PMUnfortunately I don't think so. And there is no point in discussing just that one point. What I'm saying is that it's just one of the causes of the bug.
## relative affinities for certain building types which can lead to clustering of certain building types## Note that the below scores are stored as signed 16 bit integers.# avoid building next to industryres_start_score = 1250res_near_ind = -8res_near_com = 0res_near_res = 25# everywhere is good, next to com bestcom_start_score = -125com_near_ind = 1com_near_com = 6com_near_res = 0# next to res means expensive filters and no truck after 10 pm => avoid this ...ind_start_score = -95ind_near_ind = 8ind_near_com = 0ind_near_res = -12
QuoteHowever, I admit that this is a separate issue.
Quote from: Ranran on January 09, 2021, 12:36:53 AMI have never seen a high-rise condo like the one in the image above in extended version 14, but at least before version 12 it could be built.There may be a problem with the renovation, cluster, pakset settings, etc.
Quoteleading to consistent population decline.
Quote from: Ranran on January 09, 2021, 02:13:58 AMAfter all, it's the same problem I'm pointing out that renovation changes buildings without controlling population (or jobs).
Quote from: freddyhayward on January 09, 2021, 04:11:45 AMI think that we are in agreement.
Quote1. If we use the level to determine population, jobs and renovation like standard, then balance is possible.2. If we ignore the level and use population and jobs to determine renovation, balance is still possible.3. If we use the level to define renovation but jobs and population are separately defined like current extended, the balance breaks.So the best options are 1 and 2. I suggest 2.
Quote from: Vladki on January 09, 2021, 02:40:55 PM@ranran, @freddy, I think that the fact that renovation (rising level), may reduce population or jobs, has nothing to do with cities being unable to grow. It is the worlds population:jobs ratio that affects this. What needs to be fixed is perhaps a fix of cityrules, to enable more COM/IND buildings to be built, or to enforce industry chains to spawn if the ratio gets close to the stall point (8:1)
--- Pak128.Britain-Ex/config/cityrules.tab 2020-01-20 06:10:59.000000000 +0100+++ pak128.CS-Ex/config/cityrules.tab 2017-05-09 21:53:53.913189242 +0200-# Note that the below scores are stored as signed 16 bit integers. # avoid building next to industry-res_start_score = 1250+res_start_score = 0 res_near_ind = -8 res_near_com = 0-res_near_res = 25+res_near_res = 8 # everywhere is good, next to com best-com_start_score = -125+com_start_score = -10 com_near_ind = 1-com_near_com = 6-com_near_res = 0+com_near_com = 8+com_near_res = 1 # next to res means expensive filters and no truck after 10 pm => avoid this ...-ind_start_score = -95+ind_start_score = 0 ind_near_ind = 8 ind_near_com = 0-ind_near_res = -12+ind_near_res = -8