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PakSets and Customization => Pak128 => Pak128 Add-ons and Graphics => Topic started by: VS on May 26, 2012, 08:14:33 PM

Title: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on May 26, 2012, 08:14:33 PM
So... what do you think is the best colour variant... and what is still missing? I think the white is best, and consider adding one of these huge industrial lighting poles.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: ӔO on May 26, 2012, 08:27:36 PM
I think the beige/cream looks best


what is missing? maybe a slightly larger 'watch step' black and yellow striping?
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: mEGa on May 27, 2012, 08:08:05 AM
I agree with AEO.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: greenling on May 27, 2012, 12:55:14 PM
vs
The Photo looks good out!
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on May 27, 2012, 03:41:17 PM
Okay! Any further opinions now?

I am not sure if this is too empty, or empty enough for the purpose...
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: ӔO on May 27, 2012, 06:04:36 PM
I think it looks great. The entrance for the ramp areas should be kept clean.

But, if you wanted to, boxes or pallets opposite the booth might not be bad.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on May 27, 2012, 09:45:28 PM
Thanks :) This does look reasonably fitting, maybe... What next? Suggest a tile?

Actually, what kind of tile would need to be "high"? I think staying on the ground without artificial raising would be preferred for most installations. Only things that need connecting with (some types of) rail platforms require same height, sort of...
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: ӔO on May 27, 2012, 09:51:18 PM
For the empty tiles?

Maybe some ISO containers, pallets of boxes, some trailers and fork lift?

Some sort of barrier, like a fence comes to mind, but I'm not sure how well that will work with the various tiles.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on May 27, 2012, 10:17:52 PM
Yes, containers and crates are what I thought, too. Machinery to manipulate these sounds good, too.

Fences would be really ugly, or... dunno. Player would have to manually place the tiles in correct rotation. That is, if these were based on buildings, like this. They can be ways (like paths in pak96.comic). Of course using rotating buildings means I would have to paint only two 4-rotation tiles (straight & corner).

Still, I'd prefer to make items that an average player will find enjoyable in the basic package, without scratching his head too much what goes where and what combines with what. (Sources will be fully available so that this is an open option for others.)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: gwalch on May 29, 2012, 09:08:56 PM
Some containers... and maybe a crane ?
For exemple :
(http://www.imageshotel.org/images/atelier1728/sdc10342copie.jpg)
This one was built in 1901 !
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on May 29, 2012, 09:17:48 PM
I worked in one, but it was much more modern... and I never finished it :(
I think the containers were a bit too big, and there's a lack of light maybe...
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: greenling on May 29, 2012, 09:26:38 PM
Zeno
The Container crane on the Photo looks be nice out!
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: mEGa on May 30, 2012, 05:41:33 AM
@ Zeno,
It's a pity for containers because it looks good !
Your idea is nice because she get a lot of realism.

@Gwalch

Good idea !

Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on May 30, 2012, 08:21:30 AM
Go, Zeno, go! We can split the work :D
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on May 30, 2012, 10:23:25 AM
Heh... would you suggest smaller containers? I think the current ones (the ones in the station itself) are too small, I'd have done them a little bigger. Mine could be a bit smaller, that's true... maybe we can get to an arrangement though. Also I could repaint the station too with "new" containers on it. I'll look for the sources when I'm back at home tonight.

I will also look for other stations I may have... I can remember about steel and wood ones probably, but not sure.

Edit: This one I made for container was 2x3 big... probably a "small" version of 1x2 would be nice also. That old crane doesn't match containers, but could use some boxes or pallets instead for pre-1960 aprox.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on May 30, 2012, 11:04:04 AM
The containers on station are probably these used on cars, too, thus < 1/2 tile. A compromise in size would be nice :)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on May 30, 2012, 03:47:56 PM
I think they will be very near to 1/2 tile, which keeps being a bit small for me... Let me test it anyway and post some pics (an image is worthier than 1000 words!  :P ).
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on May 30, 2012, 10:22:56 PM
Made some changes. Added more light and containers are now 0.8 times 1/2 tile.
Tilecutter only lets me cut the south direction, doesn't change the mask if I add another direction, so at the moment is single direction version (although I have sources for all 4 views). I'll check versions tomorrow, maybe there's an update out there.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: sdog on May 31, 2012, 12:27:27 AM
while it looks rather good, building a crane that way wouldn't allow loading trains.

Is it possible to have the superstructure exceed the tile (I'm thinking of oversized planes) in a way to allow a platform tile be built below one side of the crane. The crane would run parallel to the rails. (I assume platform tiles can't be more than one tile wide.)

Some markings, for road vehicles and where containers may or may not be placed would look good on the concrete below the crane.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on May 31, 2012, 06:40:52 AM
Yep, the crane should move along the rails, I know. But there's no way to do that in simutrans other than giving the user a puzzle set of different tiles to build each station :(
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: martin on May 31, 2012, 07:36:28 PM
I think it looks great and surely don't want to spoil the fun but shouldn't it be better to make it look like the in this image?
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on May 31, 2012, 07:59:11 PM
Nothing can be (reliably) on one tile of station and anything else at once. (If that's what you mean.)

Shape of crane... I'm not expert :)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: martin on May 31, 2012, 08:39:15 PM
Actually my idea is to rotate the crane and cranetracks 90 degrees so that they come in parallel with the railtracks. The crane can then hover above the railtracks...  IIRC there is also a harbourcrane (pak64?) with part of it hovering above the water.

containers must then be moved through te legs of the crane to the station. Maybe the legs should then be placed al little further apart. 
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on May 31, 2012, 09:57:52 PM
Just an idea, but we could include a rail station in the extension, not usable of course, but would give a nice look to it. What do you think?
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: ӔO on May 31, 2012, 10:58:49 PM
Quote from: Zeno on May 31, 2012, 09:57:52 PM
Just an idea, but we could include a rail station in the extension, not usable of course, but would give a nice look to it. What do you think?

Sounds like the doorway to a full revamp of the cargo platforms and cargo station extensions. ;)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on June 01, 2012, 08:01:39 AM
Well, got this one in mind, and a couple of simple rail/empty platforms with logs (wood) and planks/pipes (steel) on it, same style than ttd, that are already almost done. I always wanted to start such a project, but also always find the same difficulties: it's rather "easy" for me to create those models and have the renders done, but every time I have to open GIMP/other to finish the stuff (repair seams between platforms, etc) I always end giving up :(
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on June 01, 2012, 09:03:23 AM
Zeno: I am not sure about the tradeoff between "looking right" and "working right". It would be good to show clearly that the track is "off limits" for vehicles in some way (maybe put some wagons there?).

ӔO: Details? Most of the stations so far are definitely good, so I'm curious what improvements would you expect?
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on June 01, 2012, 10:10:02 AM
Probably AEO is talking about bumping this thread  (http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=8968.msg83563#msg83563)again.
About the extension, I was thinking exactly that: some wagons stopped in a "terminal" rail, just below the crane. I'll test something probably tomorrow.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: mEGa on June 01, 2012, 02:46:26 PM
Why do not create 2 stucks for this addons ?
- One of 1 tile across the rail (number 1 in snapshot)
- One of several tiles for plateform storage of containers ? (number 2)

And why not use next part road plateform ? (number 3

I know : it will be difficult to arrange crane with front and back image.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: greenling on June 01, 2012, 02:59:45 PM
vilvoh
has be make crans they be go over a Road and Track!
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on June 01, 2012, 03:31:00 PM
The problem mEGa, is that you need a minimum of 4 icons in the menu bar to build that station, plus a user manual in order let people know how to build the station properly. That's the problem. Creating the station graphics is not a problem itself, just a matter of hours.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on June 01, 2012, 03:31:58 PM
Zeno said it better than me. BUT. GUYS, GUYS, DO YOU KNOW WHAT!?!

It is possible to create buildings with a hole in the middle, and you can build a station there! The screenshot shows a situation where all the 4 plain tiles are one building, and then a station is built through the empty space in the middle.

I will investigate how this works with front images, and if it is possible to stay with 128 as base tile size even for such "bridged" buildings.

This would mean one can create even truck terminals with the same crane, just build road in the middle instead of track :D
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Fabio on June 01, 2012, 03:45:25 PM
Awesome!

Actally it's something I've been wanting to test for ages, but never started...

The middle tiles could be - at ground floor and have an image from the second level up... or so I wanted to try...
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on June 01, 2012, 03:50:10 PM
Wow... let's make some tests then!
The only thing I have thought is to ask as extension the use of "macros" for buttons, I mean, a button that could be configured to build certain things in certain positions with some defined order: track+station+extension, that way wouldn't be necessary to change the current internal structure of stations (single tile) and extensions (multi tile).

edit: the problem though will be extending the crane over the "empty" hole in the building; we will need to increase the tile size of the structures, but having to cut the drawing with tilecutter I'm not sure whether that will be doable or not :-/
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Ashley on June 01, 2012, 07:01:17 PM
Oh, yeah, I knew about this years ago (and was pondering how to cope with it in TileCutter). Never got around to a solution, and as this shows it's not a particularly well used feature (until now?)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: VS on June 01, 2012, 07:04:29 PM
Zeno - oh, I tested this. Assuming:

a) the crane is always pictured in a position at the distant end from screen and
b) the facility is 3x3 or 4x4

Then, it is possible to use front-images of tiles on "second floor" and completely cover anything on the tiles inside. That's important, since they will have FrontImages, too, and these must be "overlayed" by something closer to screen.

The catch is that it will have to be a bridge crane. Well... it is theoretically possible to have a 3-piece, 2-hole structure, but that's stretching it a bit far IMHO.
http://sell.lulusoso.com/upload/20110823/handling_gantry_container_crane_of_China.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-LSyJuQ6UUiQ/TcaPOgvRoWI/AAAAAAAAAKk/xBf7qhB4qc4/s1600/gantry%2Bcrane%2Bin%2Bops.jpg
http://zzhz.com/product/gantry_crane/Rail_mounted_Container_Gantry_Crane_135.html

edit: Attached plan of how I see this...

Timothy - I doubt there will be that many buildings using large holes ;) However, this feature is popular with OpenTTD addons, too, allowing stations inside industries.
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: greenling on June 01, 2012, 07:34:13 PM
Have everyone be speak with vilvoh over this projekt?
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Lubak91 on June 01, 2012, 07:47:34 PM
VS: http://www.r148.cz/pictures/archiv/Koprivnice-Portalovy_jerab.jpg ;)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: sdog on June 01, 2012, 11:05:25 PM
Hah! i know you'd come up with a workaround, finding one of those brilliant ideas.

VS, that way one can also create overpasses over passenger stations. (you know those bridges the pax can get to stations!)




@greenling, i sent him a message
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Lubak91 on June 02, 2012, 01:44:13 AM
Also crane...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Qd1P_tbAlCQ/T8lvjgH29wI/AAAAAAAAACM/Ff4E0TyKl2s/s541/jerab.PNG)
Title: Re: Ramp/access for rail stations
Post by: Zeno on June 02, 2012, 08:16:06 AM
Wow, that crane is beautiful! :)
Title: Re: Industrial station extensions
Post by: greenling on June 02, 2012, 12:44:10 PM
Lubak91
The Crane they you be Paint it´s Very great. :) :) :) :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 02, 2012, 03:10:49 PM
Wow... and that fits on one tile?

Anyway! Sorry to interrupt the awesome movie about all the cranes with a short commercial ;D

Road stations to go with the rest of "high tile" set. What stuff do you think could go there? IMHO they're a bit too narrow for any crates or machines... And I can think only of lamps and some stairs.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on June 02, 2012, 03:15:31 PM
They look great. You're right with the objects, it's very narrow. Maybe some marks (paint) on the road could be nice, to indicate the stop place.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Vladki on June 02, 2012, 04:00:54 PM
What about this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pallet_jack
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forklift_truck
And maybe some palettes (empty or with boxes), bags (grain), kegs (beer), and such stuff.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Lubak91 on June 02, 2012, 04:05:55 PM
VS: Yes, on one tile...

Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on June 02, 2012, 04:37:50 PM
Hi,

crane looks very good.
But imho, just a little too big for pak128 game ? See next snapshot :
(http://www.simutrans-france.fr.nf/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=fr:snapshot_crane_cs.jpg)

neighborhood industrial buildings are so small than crane. Compare too with high buidlings on the left... What do you mean about it ?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Vladki on June 02, 2012, 04:52:13 PM
Lubak: The crane over railroad does not appear in menu. Perhaps some bug/typo in dat file?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Lubak91 on June 02, 2012, 05:00:42 PM
Mega: Dock crane is simply big...
https://admin.ihned.cz/attachment.php/890/35661890/aouv48BCDEGHJKLMNjl6QWfhrxyT29mn/91501297.jpg (https://admin.ihned.cz/attachment.php/890/35661890/aouv48BCDEGHJKLMNjl6QWfhrxyT29mn/91501297.jpg)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Kom%C3%A1rno,_p%C5%99%C3%ADstav,_je%C5%99%C3%A1by_a_Dunaj.JPG (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Kom%C3%A1rno,_p%C5%99%C3%ADstav,_je%C5%99%C3%A1by_a_Dunaj.JPG)

Vladki: Is in road menu...

Greenling: What bug? :o
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Vladki on June 02, 2012, 05:06:19 PM
Ah sooooo. The pak with koleje (rail) is just rails for the crane at the side of the road...
I thought it would be the same crane but build over a railroad track - so I was looking in railroad menu...
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on June 02, 2012, 05:09:06 PM
Oh, yes... A big crane As I can see. Good, sincerily
May be it will be more suited for the harbour docks ?

For example : old cranes in Nantes harbour (France):
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9d/Les_2_grues_de_nantes.jpg/800px-Les_2_grues_de_nantes.jpg)

Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on June 02, 2012, 05:11:19 PM
Quote from: Vladki on June 02, 2012, 05:06:19 PM
Ah sooooo. The pak with koleje (rail) is just rails for the crane at the side of the road...
I thought it would be the same crane but build over a railroad track - so I was looking in railroad menu...

Yes, a good Lubak's idea : use tram track to associate rail and road fret !
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Lubak91 on June 02, 2012, 05:22:01 PM
Mega: Here is tram track for rail vehicles => http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=1316.msg19829#msg19829
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 02, 2012, 08:36:54 PM
Zeno is productive.

I am lazy and tired.

More... soon, but definitely not now :D
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on June 02, 2012, 10:13:05 PM
About the road stop:
Do you use my road pavement texture? (actually it's Raven's edited)...
You can get it in the xcf source. Or even better, no pavement at all, it'll uses the road's...
You can add some yellow/black stripes on the platform edge.
And you could add some markings on the road, like to tell where the trucks should pull out.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on June 03, 2012, 08:36:41 AM
Quote from: VS on June 02, 2012, 08:36:54 PM
Zeno is productive.

I am lazy and tired.
Blender is productive. Zeno & VS were lazy and tired. Now I've slept a lot (hope you had some sleeping too), so another day is welcome.

This is starting to look promising. I'm really anxious and looking forward seeing this in simutrans, and make some real tests :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 03, 2012, 01:32:42 PM
Ladies and gentlemen, I would like to report some good progress. A dream is coming true, slowly... You have a testing pak so that you can check it's not a fake :P Only one rotation so far, though.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on June 03, 2012, 01:34:33 PM
Yay for VS!! Nice job! :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on June 03, 2012, 01:45:26 PM
Yes ! thanx VS
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 03, 2012, 01:52:58 PM
Well, it was (and still is) a joint venture, so don't forget that Zeno did all the graphics, I'm just a humble plumber and tile-cutter :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on June 03, 2012, 03:02:30 PM
Vs
Super you have be make a good work! ;D
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 03, 2012, 03:16:04 PM
Heh, preview version tested, no need for frontimages at all! Zeno rocks :)

http://vs.simutrans.com/remote_images/BIG/scrshot-cranes.jpg
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on June 03, 2012, 03:33:57 PM
Awesome piece of engineering, guys! Kudos!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Vladki on June 03, 2012, 03:46:27 PM
VS: very nice. Is the ramp extension ready? Whould you please post the pak for the ramp as well? I can find only screenshots, but not the pak.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: grampybear on June 03, 2012, 03:55:06 PM
WOW  Great work.   Thank you all
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 03, 2012, 04:15:24 PM
Ramp should be in last nightly, or next...

Crane still has something on to-do list, so in a week or two.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: IgorEliezer on June 03, 2012, 06:15:50 PM
Quote from: VS on June 03, 2012, 03:16:04 PMhttp://vs.simutrans.com/remote_images/BIG/scrshot-cranes.jpg
God! What awesome! :D
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: sdog on June 04, 2012, 03:34:33 AM
brilliant!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on June 04, 2012, 11:29:43 AM
Quote from: VS on June 03, 2012, 03:16:04 PM
Heh, preview version tested, no need for frontimages at all! Zeno rocks :)

http://vs.simutrans.com/remote_images/BIG/scrshot-cranes.jpg

While being absolutely amazing, I believe the shadows are a bit too dark, compared with the rest of the pakset (e.g. Zeno's ware storage extension used in the same preview)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on June 04, 2012, 01:49:24 PM
You're right fabio, we took as reference the south image to calculate lights, but I should have used the north view, which is the one with more shadows. That way I would have ensured enough light for all views. We'll try to adjust that for the last run, thanks for reporting :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 15, 2012, 02:58:27 PM
It seems the crane progress stalled a bit :P

Meanwhile... how about this? Another important bit for the whole thing. Comments welcome!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on June 15, 2012, 03:36:53 PM
Awesome idea!

It's something I wanted to do when I made the current bus stops, but failed to deliver a result...

Next will replace the present loading bay, I hope! ;)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: ӔO on June 15, 2012, 03:40:03 PM
maybe some white or yellow road markings for the loading bay?
or even a dead end loading bay.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on June 15, 2012, 04:40:43 PM
Very good idea !
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 15, 2012, 07:10:38 PM
Can you show me what kind of markings and where they should be? I considered these, but I'm rather clueless...
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on June 15, 2012, 07:20:02 PM
Maybe zebra marks like those for some of my tram tracks...
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 15, 2012, 08:26:19 PM
Ummm... any idea, what keywords would be good for image searches?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: ӔO on June 15, 2012, 09:20:30 PM
'loading bay'
'loading zone'
'loading dock'

seem to give good results.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on June 16, 2012, 01:38:41 PM
How about this?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on June 16, 2012, 09:59:44 PM
Nice! That kind of markings are used commonly in Spain :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on June 16, 2012, 10:16:42 PM
Very nice. Obviously they need to be different if the tile is the farthermost, the middle one or the nearmost.
But the concept is great.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: DirrrtyDirk on June 17, 2012, 10:30:38 AM
Really nice! :) But I'd make the painting on the road symmetrical - so that it looks equally well, when people use the "drive_left = 1" option.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on July 06, 2012, 02:30:59 PM
So, umm... maybe final version of that truck station? Symmetrical marks etc.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/road-cargo-stop.zip
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on July 06, 2012, 02:52:54 PM
Very nice! :thumbsup:

Just a few tips:

1) marks could be player color.

2) try to let a "hole" in the center of the stop, between the 2 loading bays. You might want to build this stop downtown (if you happen to have e.g. a supermarket there) and there might be a tram track. The tram is not supposed to stop there, but it can cross it, and the full pavement would hide the tracks.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on July 06, 2012, 03:14:21 PM
1) What marks? Ground = blended, impossible. Edge = standardized to black & yellow. I can see why there should be payer colour, but... where? ???

2) Eh :-/ I thought BackImage is drawn before (under) ways... I'll see what can be done about this. But the middle just seems to be the right size for tram track :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on July 06, 2012, 03:36:53 PM
1) Ground. You can blend player color and then "repair" it using my tool. You can take a look at the parking lot extensions, where I painfully used kerb marks in player color ;)

2) It is not. Station "back" is painted above tram tracks. Also Tunnel entrance back. You can open a bug report, if you feel it's wrong... :runaway:
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: martin on July 06, 2012, 06:45:14 PM
I put a small (1x3 tiles) version of a container crane together which could be used for smaller (end)stations...
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on July 07, 2012, 05:41:57 AM
martin
The Container cran in Photo looks good out.
Can you please post the Containtercran i will be test him.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: martin on July 08, 2012, 07:34:57 PM
OK, here it is. I coded it as an extension with no waytype assigned to it. You'll find it under "Special Construction Tools" menu
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on July 08, 2012, 09:12:58 PM
martin
thank you for the containercran!
i can now testing it.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on July 10, 2012, 05:03:43 PM
I tested crane. Good art work.
Martin I have few suggestions :

1) complete pakset :
Why do not create another single plateform with just rail of crane and few waiting containers ? See yellow square in my screenshot ?

2) amelioration of crane design :
I suggest to you make an antialiazing pixel to break edge as I made in green square.

What do U mean about it ?
(http://www.simutrans-france.fr.nf/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=fr:mod_crane.png)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on July 10, 2012, 05:35:13 PM
The crane could have something in player colour?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on July 10, 2012, 05:49:02 PM
Quote from: VS on July 10, 2012, 05:35:13 PM
The crane could have something in player colour?
Good idea... May be in center of arm as a painted logo of firm ?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on July 10, 2012, 05:52:50 PM
Yes thats a good idea!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: martin on July 10, 2012, 08:33:43 PM
Quote
1) complete pakset :
Why do not create another single plateform with just rail of crane and few waiting containers ? See yellow square in my screenshot ?

2) amelioration of crane design :
I suggest to you make an antialiazing pixel to break edge as I made in green square.

1) That's no problem to create.  However I made it as a single extension to make it easy to use and to prevent an overcrowded "special contruction tools" menu. Maybe station extensions can get their own sub-menu from "special contruction tools" especially with more station-extensions in the making... Another thing to work out is how to group the related parts together in the menu. 
@VS: Any opinion on this?

2) Antialiasing the edges is no problem. I'll look into that.

QuoteThe crane could have something in player colour?Good idea... May be in center of arm as a painted logo of firm ?

I'm not sure about a logo in player color since the player can choose from a lot of colors and not in all combinations the logo will stand out or look too great... A logo in itself is not the problem. Another option is to make the legs of the crane playercolor #1 and the beam playercolor #2. After all we can select two player colors.

Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: martin on July 17, 2012, 08:11:44 PM
I've done the antialiasing and repainted the containercrane in playercolours #1 and #2.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on July 17, 2012, 08:22:20 PM
Cool.
Good work.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on July 17, 2012, 08:24:57 PM
Fantastic! I am away for a few weeks, but you can commit, so feel free to go ahead.... ;)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on July 19, 2012, 09:42:49 AM
Brilliant ! I vote for it ;)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Masu on September 24, 2012, 08:45:54 AM
Hey!

I have been testing this addons and i found a bug.

When i rotate the map, in VS model graphics disapear.

(http://i49.tinypic.com/icjvc2.png)

(http://i47.tinypic.com/24lk13m.png)

PD: real nice addons ;), great work!

I leave here a video where u can see this addons:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ekd5vybEWE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ekd5vybEWE)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 07, 2012, 02:25:54 PM
The huge crane is in r963 or whatever the number is... *dies*

The truck platform is still not ready... but will be.

And there's a ton of stuff from Zeno to go through...




I guess there is no denying I abuse ellipsis, so here you get at least one exclamation mark! For diversity!
:D
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 09, 2012, 09:29:17 PM
Doublepost, mwahaha! But something changed.

Current state of truck stop, on all roads and with all tram tracks. Please keep in mind that it is meant for asphalt roads, not dirt et al. IMHO it looks reasonable on 70 and 90 kph ones, where it is intended, and city roads too. But criticize anyway (as if you would not :P ).

screenshot:
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/hightruckstop-preview.png
(> 500 kB)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on October 09, 2012, 09:41:59 PM
These stops look very nice. I thought we were never going to have an alternative to our beloved truck stop! :)

About my stuff, I'll have to take some control of it, really. IIRC we decided it's not still the correct color on the tiles, so it was needed to render again those cranes. Next week I hope to have a little more spare time for it.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on October 09, 2012, 09:50:36 PM
Nice, although I would personally use the "standard" asphalt (i.e. the one used in city roads)within the loading bay marks (leaving only the central stripe for trams which happen to pass). Like this it looks fabulous on asphalted roads (and cobblestone as well), but it's quite ugly on dirt roads, gravel roads and the like.

Another thing: middle sections of the stop should have the stripes edited to have a seamless pattern, instead of starting and ending straight (which is great for start and end) and zig-zagging only in the middle of the tile.
(Something like the bus stops)
Also the straight lines should be 1.5 px thick (for consistency with all the other road marks), using a px of a darker player color shade.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 10, 2012, 06:08:24 AM
Hmmm. I will see what can be done about this... the list finally seems manageable ;)




So... There is a conflict. With or without asphalt included in the part with stripes?

* Without: Breaks on gravel, dirt and unknown number of potential add-ons, due to smaller width.

* With: Potentially visually clashes with different colour of roads. Not "just a ramp" any longer.

Which price do you like better / wish to pay?




A couple of author's notes, so that you understand the situation better:

Originally, I envisioned this as a piece for heavy industrial stations outside cities. It matches the structures intended for railway. For industrial settings, I expected the two asphalt roads, and tried to optimize for these. In my aesthetic view, tram tracks or dirt roads have nothing to do around this. That the sidewalk fits is a nice coincidence, since all roads share the same dimensions of driving area. I am currently contemplating another road, to match all the pieces, which would have very bright surface compared to these, and might work great with this. Adding a solid piece of road would mean another choice, this time between dark asphalt ant the hypothetical lighter surface. Either way, the result ill not look so well in the other setting.

Still, it is impossible to tell people what to do with this in game, so all Fabio's points cannot be dismissed. So I am torn. I have my perfect idea how this should work and look, but it seems impossible to have.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Roads on October 10, 2012, 07:03:31 PM
As far as I'm concerned, I don't care how you do it.  Everything you've done looks far better than the little blue or whatever color box we have now.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Sarlock on October 10, 2012, 08:14:50 PM
I'll chime in with some thoughts:
The conflict with soil/dirt roads isn't really an issue as I don't think anyone will be building a modern road freight terminal on a dirt road.  It's possible, I guess, and anyone can do it if they want, but if the player is in the least bit concerned about aesthetics, they won't do it.  (and if they don't care how it looks, they can do what they want!).
What I think would be the best solution to the issue with the paint on the ground is to select a fairly "neutral" shade of pavement and put it inside the paint marks on the road.  Pick a colour that works well with more player color selections.  Certain road types might clash a little bit with the colour, but if you pick a neutral shade of medium grey, I don't think it will be too bad.  Maybe develop a couple of different shades and we can test them and see what the best selection is.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: sdog on October 10, 2012, 11:01:09 PM
Quote from: Sarlock on October 10, 2012, 08:14:50 PM
The conflict with soil/dirt roads isn't really an issue as I don't think anyone will be building a modern road freight terminal on a dirt road.  It's possible, I guess, and anyone can do it if they want, but if the player is in the least bit concerned about aesthetics, they won't do it.  (and if they don't care how it looks, they can do what they want!).
+1
just keep the ground transparent as it is now.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 13, 2012, 01:35:56 PM
I have collected the arguments for "no asphalt":
To top that list, I'll just steal the stripes from bus stops :P
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 14, 2012, 03:39:55 PM
So! Where do I put something player coloured on this, so that it still tiles well?

Preview with asphalt which will not be present in final rendering:
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/road-platform-stop-fabiostripes.png)

Stripes © Fabio :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on October 14, 2012, 04:09:38 PM
Why not in place of yellow lines on road ?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 14, 2012, 05:07:11 PM
I thought about this, but... same reason as for warning marks on edge. Have you ever seen them green or violet? They are always white or yellow...
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Lmallet on October 14, 2012, 05:08:08 PM
How about coloured bands on the crates?  Or maybe player colour bollards?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on October 14, 2012, 06:29:47 PM
Color stickers on the crates? In real life logistics companies would put their own stickers on the crates they haul.
Also a sign for the loading zone, like one of these: www.google.com/search?q=loading+zone+sign&btnG=&tbm=isch
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Zeno on October 14, 2012, 08:23:44 PM
As fabio suggests I also think that a sign would be nice. Probably the PC should be drawn in the extension building next to the stop (there will be one, won't it?), although a sign would also be nice.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 14, 2012, 09:14:50 PM
A sign at start of stop sounds like what it needs... back to GIMP! :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 17, 2012, 02:31:19 PM
This seems rather inobtrusive, but maybe not strong/large enough to be seen? Normal road signs are twice as big.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/road-platform-stop-2pcsigns.png
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on October 17, 2012, 02:40:02 PM
I like it!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on October 17, 2012, 02:42:17 PM
Quote from: VS on October 17, 2012, 02:31:19 PM
This seems rather inobtrusive, but maybe not strong enough to be seen?

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/road-platform-stop-2pcsigns.png (https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/road-platform-stop-2pcsigns.png)
For me it's enough.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Sarlock on October 17, 2012, 04:31:44 PM
I think it's great... can't wait to add it to my games!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: sdog on October 17, 2012, 06:49:29 PM
That sign is large enough. A few pixel are enough to identify a stop when one is looking for it. It doesn't have to flash with player colour.

It looks quite good now.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 17, 2012, 06:59:53 PM
Here we go... pak in attachment, screenshot linked

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63534647/cargostop-overview-v2.png
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on October 17, 2012, 07:11:22 PM
The Photo are Cool. 8)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Lmallet on October 17, 2012, 07:19:56 PM
Nice! Now the Japanese road trains will have somewhere to stop!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Sarlock on October 17, 2012, 07:24:02 PM
Nice job, VS.  Already added to my game :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on October 17, 2012, 08:19:40 PM
Thanks for all the positive responses and for the whole process :) In r975!

Sooo! What next? A more city-friendly variant? No boxes to steal, lower,...?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: tonu on November 14, 2012, 05:10:09 PM
The cargo stop is nice, very good work!, but it isn't a "cargo-type" stop (It doesn't show the cargo symbol under the stop name in the stop information window), so it doesn't receives goods if you don't put an extension or something else. Can you change that?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Fabio on November 14, 2012, 06:31:35 PM
Quote from: tonu on November 14, 2012, 05:10:09 PM
The cargo stop is nice, very good work!, but it isn't a "cargo-type" stop (It doesn't show the cargo symbol under the stop name in the stop information window), so it doesn't receives goods if you don't put an extension or something else. Can you change that?

Thank you for reporting, tonu.

Fixed in r1033.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on December 30, 2012, 06:48:37 PM
Got some free time - painted some boxes... Which do you like better? Smaller/bigger, uniform/coloured etc.

I may have some plans with these... ;)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Raiser on December 30, 2012, 07:38:22 PM
Quote from: VS on December 30, 2012, 06:48:37 PM
Which do you like better? Smaller/bigger, uniform/coloured etc.

Hi VS - Very nice! I like the coloured more.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Sarlock on December 30, 2012, 10:25:01 PM
Very nice, VS... I definitely like the second one more.  :)
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: IgorEliezer on December 31, 2012, 01:50:20 AM
Quote from: VS on December 30, 2012, 06:48:37 PM
*VS's boxy platforms*
This made me remember a very old extension request (or random idea?) by which we suggested that platforms could display less or more passengers according to how crowded or empty it would be. For example, if the platform has no passenger waiting, the game would display an empty platform; if full, a "packed" platform would be displayed.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on December 31, 2012, 10:27:55 AM
I prefer various style (second picture); more realistic imho.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on January 04, 2013, 08:10:53 PM
VS
Both photos are good!
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: VS on January 05, 2013, 10:37:44 PM
Some fun with lights. If built next to each other, they will tile (for lack of better term). But it looks like a forest of lamps :(

Anyway, do you think a "bit" like this would be useful only with crates? I may add the lamps to plain tile instead, at decreased frequency...

PS: I want it to rotate well on its own and be timeless, hence rather conservative approach to what could be there.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: Sarlock on January 06, 2013, 12:37:05 AM
Cool idea.  A bit too crowded with the lamps, however.  Perhaps just two lamps (bottom two (south and east one)?) per tile instead of four?
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: greenling on January 06, 2013, 11:46:49 AM
Yes the lamps make a little problem.
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: mEGa on January 06, 2013, 02:57:37 PM
To feed discussion about lamp.
I mean  it's better if they are two placed only in line on middle of platform.   
Title: Re: Industrial stations & extensions
Post by: IgorEliezer on January 06, 2013, 03:36:18 PM
Quote from: Sarlock on January 06, 2013, 12:37:05 AM
A bit too crowded with the lamps, however.  Perhaps just two lamps (bottom two (south and east one)?) per tile instead of four?
Agreed. :)