The International Simutrans Forum

PakSets and Customization => Pak128.Britain => Topic started by: The Hood on February 03, 2009, 09:49:19 AM

Title: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 03, 2009, 09:49:19 AM
I am finally making progress with releasing a new version of PakBritain!  :)

I am slowly adding the sources to the simutrans sourceforge site:
http://simutrans.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/simutrans/pak128.Britain/

So keep checking there for the latest developments.

At present you need aspects of standard pak128 to run - currently it's best just to use pakBritain stuff as replacements for certain bits of standard pak128 until I can get a standalone release together.

Current progress is in this thread: http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=1467.0

Watch this space - but if you want to help, then get in touch and it will probably happen quicker!  The aim is for graphical consistency so if you do want to draw stuff, please ask first and either Kieron or myself will help make sure that it looks right with the rest of the set.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 03, 2009, 02:15:07 PM
Excellent, glad to see progress on this! What there is of PakBritain so far is rather good, and I am very much looking forward to seeing more. I should strongly encourage anyone interested in British transportation to get involved - it's open-source, so just find the source files, tinker with them, and upload something! The more people who help the better.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Frank on February 03, 2009, 04:04:47 PM
BritGoods.pak ?

pleace not merge goods pak files

see here http://archive.forum.simutrans.com/topic/07012.0/index.html#msg62504 (http://archive.forum.simutrans.com/topic/07012.0/index.html#msg62504)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: IgorEliezer on February 03, 2009, 04:32:10 PM
A little question:

why pakBritain.128? It would be better to call this pakset pak128.Britain like pak128.Japan and pak96.comic?

I think we could keep a standard about pakset names.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 03, 2009, 05:24:47 PM
After some testing with the new industries in place (thank you, The Hood!), might I suggest the following additions to the to do list:

(1) some sort of means of boats serving the fishing ground;

(2) new menu buttons (PakBritain themed);

(3) a means of producing "planks" (for the furniture factory - at least, in 1910, furniture factories appear but wood yards do not);

(4) translation texts for the new factories and types of goods;

(5) PakBritain themed warehouse (etc.) buildings for the stations and/or freight-specific stations;

(6) a fix for the issue that I have just noticed in which passenger vehicles get added to the freight tab with the new industry/goods set installed;

(7) some level of rebalancing of production - production at the grain farm, for example, is 1,000 bags, which totally overwhelms even a fairly substantial railway train making regular trips to a very nearby factory (similarly with coal and iron ore - the stations fill up completely seconds after the train has left); and

(8) PakBritain coloured rivers.

I also notice that the system of factories not letting the stop get more than slightly overcrowded works well (thank you, Isidoro).

Edit: It has occurred to me on reflection that there is a potential problem with the industry chain structure in the new British industries set - as I understand it, most of the industry chains end in a shop of some or other sort in the towns. However, Simutrans has a system in which finished goods can be delivered to towns themselves; indeed, the delivery of goods to towns is part of what makes them grow. So, if all industry chains end in shops in towns, the shops will consume all the goods, leaving none to be delivered directly to the towns to enable them to grow.

Generally, in the standard Paks, ordinary goods are left to be delivered to towns, whereas specialist items such as cars go to a separate specialist retailer in the towns. It might be worth trying to pick apart what would count as ordinary goods (hardware, pottery, groceries, etc.) from extraordinary goods (cars, etc.), and remove the shops for the ordinary goods (perhaps making them ordinary town buildings instead, which might go some way to increase variety of buildings in the towns).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 04, 2009, 09:26:20 AM
@Frank:
I wasn't aware of that.  I generally merge the pak files to avoid clutter in the folder (and paks can be unmerged with makeobj extract anyway?).  And is it not possible to view the sources anyway, so you can see the goods types in there without needing to view separate goods.*.pak?  But if you still think it is best to go down the goods.*.pak route, I can do that.

@Igor
We've had lots of debate about what it's called - somehow much confusion over the real name of the pak, but never has anyone suggested Pak128.Britain (until you!).  Kieron started by calling it PakBritain, and we added the .128 to make it clear it was a 128-scale pak.  I don't have a huge appetite for re-branding it, and in any case it's probably Kieron's to decide!

@Jamespetts
1) Not sure what you mean - boats should be able to serve it already (or do you mean we need to draw them for PakBritain?)
2) Eventually maybe...
3) You can change this in the .dat file - if there is anything that isn't "right" in the current set just email me a version with proposed changes.  Chances are I will accept it!
4) Will do
5) Agreed
6) ???!!! - will investigate but I don't remember that happening to me.
7) see point 3 - if you have time to do this I will have more time for drawing.  Besides, I can't remember what works properly in the game anymore balancing wise as I haven't actually played for so long!  Would you like to volunteer yourself?  As long as it works OK with PakBritain vehicles, then I'm happy (vehicle capacities in PakBritain are greater than in standard Pak128 I think).
8 ) See the first post :-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Spike on February 04, 2009, 10:49:39 AM
Edit: It has occurred to me on reflection that there is a potential problem with the industry chain structure in the new British industries set - as I understand it, most of the industry chains end in a shop of some or other sort in the towns. However, Simutrans has a system in which finished goods can be delivered to towns themselves; indeed, the delivery of goods to towns is part of what makes them grow. So, if all industry chains end in shops in towns, the shops will consume all the goods, leaving none to be delivered directly to the towns to enable them to grow.

It seems I missed much while being away from Simutrans. In the past there was no "direct delivery to towns", but actually good chain endpoints were factories that only consume goods and produce none. (Shops are such factories, too, just with a constraint to be built in/near a town).

This means, I'll have to change pakHajo.Evolution, since otherwise towns cannot grow properly? How is this "deliver goods to town directly" done?

Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 04, 2009, 11:04:15 AM
Now I'm confused.  Where in towns accepts the goods?  I have never seen a factory in simutrans wanting to supply goods to a town, only to another industry.

I thought the linking of town growth to industry was just a case of towns will grow more rapidly if you supply the end-consumers based there (i.e. the shops of the PakBritain set).  It makes no sense to send goods straight to a house or whatever in the town - goods should be delivered to shops or whatever, as is the case in PakBritain.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on February 04, 2009, 11:11:31 AM
Goods move only between factories, nothing new there. Goods supply to factories (production) stimulates population growth by some %; no idea if it's counted for "workers from" or just factories within city limits rectangle.

PakBritain has small shops (1x1 factories) that are built in towns. That might be where your confusion comes from.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Spike on February 04, 2009, 11:22:10 AM
Thanks for the clarification :)

pakHajo.evolution has such small shops, too, although only one sort if I remember correctly. Good to know that this scheme still works.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 04, 2009, 11:40:44 AM
Phew, my sanity remains intact, the world is as it should be (well...)!

That means there should be no problem with the current set-up in PakBritain.  :-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Stubbsy on February 04, 2009, 04:39:11 PM
Is there anything that you need help doing? I really want to see the pakBritain to go far as i live in England. I'm not all that good with painting but can do the odd thing, but i can help out with some coding and testing?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 04, 2009, 06:02:12 PM
Testing and balancing are always welcome.  A big thing with the industries is the capacities and productivity, and balancing that against goods costs.  All the sources for industry and goods are on the sourceforge link, so if you wanted to have a play and see whether you can make things work sensibly then go ahead. 

The other thing that needs help with is compiling timelines for vehicles.  Jamespetts did some buses, and trains are pretty complete anyway, but we need trucks and boats as well. 

If you do manage to do anything like this, post it in the forum or PM me.  Thanks for the offer.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 05, 2009, 09:10:39 AM
(6) a fix for the issue that I have just noticed in which passenger vehicles get added to the freight tab with the new industry/goods set installed;

Update: It's doing this on mine too.  I have managed to fix it, but I am not sure how yet!  I think the problem is related to the BritGoods.pak - once I have worked out exactly what I did to fix the problem I will update the SVN.  Can you make sure that you only have BritGoods.pak and not also good.Passagiere.pak or good.all.pak in your pak folder?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Stubbsy on February 05, 2009, 06:00:43 PM
Okay :D i'll start having a look, the weekend as tonight i'm busy and it's my dad's b'day tomorrow :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 07, 2009, 11:46:43 AM
The Hood,

oops - sorry about misunderstanding how towns accepting goods works. That actually makes far more sense than how I imagined it to work anyway. (Although, this does perhaps show the need for better documentation somewhere...).

I may well have a look into doing some of those things when I have a chance (am currently working on industries closing down when they pass their retirement date: the complicated bit is de-linking them from the chain and then checking that nothing in the chain ends up orphaned). It might be helpful if there were a universal to-do list including all of these items that people can come along and decide to work on (posting here when they start work to avoid duplication), which can then be crossed off one by one when complete. (Indeed, maybe, not just a forum thread, but some free, web-based project management software?)

Any progress with the passenger/goods vehicle issue?

VS,

there is a code comment that states that the "workers from" has no effect on the game and is just there for cosmetic reasons. From what I understand of the passenger code, towns generate passengers; a fixed proportion of those go to industries, and, those that do go to industries select a random one to go to. It would not be too hard, I imagine, to make the passengers actually come from the stipulated towns and nowhere else, or even to count the industry as a building in that town that provides that town with "jobs", but the issue is whether that would slow things down too much (I imagine that it was set up as it was for a reason).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 07, 2009, 01:15:57 PM
You're right, I will start a new thread as a to do list.  Passenger/goods vehicle issue fixed, still not sure how but it seems fine, so I will update svn.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on February 08, 2009, 09:51:55 AM
Seems fair enough to call it pak128.Britain
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on February 08, 2009, 12:34:10 PM
You forgot to include depots.

I love the unified look of everything.

Sadly here it's mostly shades of grey, brown and black. That is a design choice I guess... Prepare for some complaints about that. On LCD screens it probably looks way nicer - I turned contrast and brightness all the way up to 100% and then it was a very different picture -  but I don't want to burn out my eyes :)

Industry chains are quite nicely simple, starting transportation should not be a problem. At the same time there is lots of variety, so it does not feel too simple.

What I really liked was the multitude of chimneys rising from most of factories. It certainly gives an industrial feel. Also no qualms about industry sizes... it certainly works :D Industries are a bit bland graphically; when comparing to 128, there are large empty spaces. Add some... stuff. Piles of dirt, machinery, whatever. But that is up to you.

Technical note, you have somewhere in the process a wrong template for tile shape, when moving the info-tool along edges of industries, yellow bits stay visible. Or the tile from render is too short in front. Anyway, that is absolutely negligible inconvenience at worst.

One bad thing I noticed was that the small end consumers in city are not distinguished enough from regular city houses. I guess it was bad luck, but the first three I looked at were rotated away and most of their banners were hidden. I had to "grapple" with info-tool around the city and hope I hit them. You may want to reconsider giving all four rotations to them, so that the banner always faces screen and is well visible.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 08, 2009, 01:16:47 PM
@VS
Thanks for the feedback. 

Depots are on my to-do list.
http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=1467.0
Currently you have to use pak128 depots.  That will change once I've finished doing the wretched trees! :P

The colour scheme was Kieron's idea - I'm just keeping with that.  I have an LCD screen and I've not noticed a problem, in fact IMHO pak128 is too bright and garish!  Different preferences I suppose but we will see what people think.

Re industries, are there any in particular which are too empty?  I will probably revisit some of them over time, but currently it's time to draw other stuff.  Also if you could let me know which ones have a problem with the info-tool and I will try to fix.  I probably didn't line up the image properly in tilecutter.

About the end-consumers, the idea is to have them blend in with the city.  That was a design choice, as most shops tend to do that.  I personally prefer it the way I made it, but if lots of people think it is bad this way, then I will consider changing it.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 08, 2009, 01:20:37 PM
I am definitely looking forward to British depots!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 08, 2009, 01:33:52 PM
Another thought about end-consumers.  I wanted it so that they would always face the road, as the normal 1x1 citybuildings always do.  Apparently this needs a code change, but I don't know if anyone (jamespetts? ;)) is able to create a patch to do this?

Oh, and the quick way to find out which are industry and which are just citybuildings is to use the " key :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 08, 2009, 01:42:19 PM
Hmm, I'm not familiar with that bit of code - I'm still trying to get industry retire dates to work properly! Do you know how the .dat file is set up to enable city buildings always to face the road the same way?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on February 08, 2009, 02:01:27 PM
Hood: You're absolutely right about that. It makes sense that if 128.Britain looks well on your monitor, 128 must be too bright and oversaturated. Part of the problem is - I can't test on LCD as I do not have one.

About the small shops, take it all just as a suggestion from one player. If it keeps coming, maybe change it. I would agree that it is not really so important to know where the shop is, once you have a line serving it.

I will take a look at the empty parts.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 08, 2009, 02:17:24 PM
I prefer the idea of shops blending in, but I have noticed that they always seem to be rotated so that the canopy faces away from the user. Perhaps the .dat files could be changed so that the images are listed the other way around?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 08, 2009, 02:44:02 PM
Here's the old discussion.

http://archive.forum.simutrans.com/topic/07269.0/index.html

I think at present, it must always face away, in which case I will alter the dats.  I would like to see behaviour like current citybuildings where they align with roads.  Presumably the code is already there for citybuildings so it can't be too hard to achieve.  There is nothing different in the dats, so it must be in the code.

Edit:  I have checked and with 1x1 industry you always get the rotation to face away!  I will change this in the dats to face forwards, but that still doesn't make it always face road.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on February 08, 2009, 02:52:13 PM
Empty factories:

refinery
both pits
coal mine
brickworks
slaughterhouse
steel mill
grain farm

I realized that what makes them look somewhat empty is
a) lack of things as mentioned above,
b) very clean pavement texture and
c) pavement going all the way to end of tile.

Eg. refinery has just lots of empty asphalt. Where are the trucks? Same for, say, grain farm - the paving inside is so clean, where has all the hay and farm tools gone? No idea how farms in Britain look, but here you always find them surrounded by a lot of junk like derelict tractors. Paving is partly to blame, since it is clean everywhere and lots of it. I'd say, (c) could fix a lot of that very fast.

But this also depends on rotation... sometimes some areas are visible, sometimes not. And sometimes industrial areas really do have these large spaces...

I can not find the building with missing line any more. Guess it was some weirdness then :-\
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 08, 2009, 02:55:29 PM
Ahh, I see from that old thread that one of the main problems is that not all industries abut roads at all...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on February 08, 2009, 07:51:19 PM
Colour scheme was just what I felt to be 'right' - I've never actually seen screenshots on a crt because all my development work was done on lcd monitors.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on February 08, 2009, 08:25:55 PM
Screenshots never help, you would have to take a photo of monitor ::)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 12, 2009, 08:39:36 PM
A glimpse of the latest progress:
A modern train depot and a couple of trees.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 12, 2009, 08:48:08 PM
Aha, looking very promising!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 12, 2009, 10:34:07 PM
And a steam era depot (and more views of trees)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 12, 2009, 11:21:34 PM
Very lovely! Like those trees...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 19, 2009, 05:44:06 PM
Here's some more new stuff.  Old tram and bus depots, along with electrification for tram and trolleybus (even though there are no PakBritain trolleybuses yet!).

If you think the electrification looks similar to standard pak128, that's because it is - thanks to Timothy for letting me use his electrification as a template!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 19, 2009, 09:37:24 PM
I like that! That is very good indeed. Very atmospheric...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 23, 2009, 08:35:57 PM
Rail electrification:
Top = old-style DC catenary
Middle = modern high-speed AC catenary
Bottom = DC Third Rail

I'll upload the latest stuff to SVN soon!
Now added ways and depots.  Note that High Speed Rail track is missing as I'm still waiting for the sources for that off Kieron.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 23, 2009, 11:45:13 PM
Very nice - it's good to see such excellent progress being made!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on February 28, 2009, 03:16:47 PM
Latest screenshot:
- new brick rail tunnel
- cobblestone road and dirt track (painted by Kieron, and I've now received the sources for!)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on February 28, 2009, 03:33:13 PM
The progress on this is very impressive!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: micslu on March 02, 2009, 07:17:06 PM
I'm impressed with the consistent moody tone of PakBritain.
It's getting harder to decide which pakset I want to play next!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 03, 2009, 06:18:57 PM
Thanks for the feedback!  I wouldn't recommend a playing a full game with pakBritain quite yet - there's still a lot missing and it's not balanced.  Although you can use standard 128 objects to fill the gaps in.

Anyway, with many thanks to fabio (who let me shamelessly steal and modify these) I have done rail signals.  You will probably recognise most already!  Top line is really old signals, middle is classic, bottom is modern era.
L-R: normal signal, pre-signal, long-block signal, choose-signal, end of choose signal.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on March 03, 2009, 08:58:54 PM
Slight issue with signals - these are on the right hand side of the track whereas in general left hand running is the rule in the UK. Though I don't know if there's an easy fix for that or even whether it's worth changing...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 03, 2009, 09:05:04 PM
Excellent! I love the man with the flag ;-) Any plans to upload these and the roads to the SVN any time soon...?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 03, 2009, 10:27:50 PM
@kieron - I would like left hand signals too, problem is the way the graphics engine draws them, and they don't look right (if signals can get front and back images in the future, I will change to left hand signals).

@jamespetts - going up when I finish this message :-) ...now done

and as an added treat, two more rail tunnels (old stone portal tunnel and high speed concrete portal).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 03, 2009, 10:28:43 PM
Lovely!

Edit: The latest upload to the SVN is missing the image files for the TGV track, the cobblestone road and the dirt road.

Edit 2: Incidentally, I have noticed some items missing from the SVN that are present in the binary release: the Metropolitan dreadnought carriages (both versions), the Metropolitan 1907 motorised stock and the Metropolitan Vickers electric are all in the released binary version of PakBritain, but not the SVN. Indeed, the latest binary, in turn, is missing a number of items that were also present in previous binary releases, including the Metropolitan E-class tank locomotive, the DLR trains and the Metropolitan Bogie Third carriage. All of them seem to be drawn by Kieron. It would be rather good to have them back, as it seems a terrible waste for them not to be used.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on March 04, 2009, 10:11:51 PM
Originally those were part of a separate pak (london transport).

I'd suggest maybe make the stone portal castellated to provide a bit of variety?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 04, 2009, 11:34:23 PM
Kieron,

would it be possible for you to release the sources for the London Transport pack? Those are useful and well-drawn vehicles. And I agree about the castellation, although I imagine that it would be a bit tricky to draw ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 05, 2009, 09:00:32 AM
Thought I had added the way images to SVN but they were in a different folder so maybe not.

I think I do have the sources for the LU stuff (they are in my development pak at any rate, so I would think that means I have the sources), and I thought I'd added them too, but obviously not.

I'll investigate both this evening and add stuff that I can find.

Good idea about castellation - shouldn't be too tricky in blender.  I might also make the stone tunnel a bit more sandstone yellow colour to differentiate from the concrete one.  Thoughts?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 05, 2009, 10:32:04 AM
Agree with the sandstone colour idea :-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Spike on March 05, 2009, 11:21:13 AM
I'm impressed with the consistent moody tone of PakBritain.

I like that very much, too :) It really gives it a unique flavour.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 05, 2009, 08:28:05 PM
Thanks for all the positive comments.

I've dug out the LU images and put them on SVN, and also added the way graphics. 
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 05, 2009, 09:06:38 PM
Excellent - thank you! Incidentally, when I have finished my remaining planned coding projects for Simutrans-Experimental (that is, (1) vehicle upgrades, on which I am working now, and (2) a new revenue system), I am planning to do some work on PakBritain, partly to create a PakBritain-Experimental to go with Simutrans-Experimental, but also to add to it generally. There is a lorry timeline still outstanding, I believe...?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 05, 2009, 10:45:43 PM
@james: If you have time for PakBritain that would be massively helpful, even if it's non-graphics related.  The lorry timeline is still outstanding, also for canals and possibly planes (although I'm planning on using Zeno's work on planes as they are fairly international).  I have a planned timeline for completing London Underground stuff and narrow gauge trains. 

And if anyone feels like learning blender, there's plenty of graphics work too (some of it not too hard and can be made by varying existing stuff).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 05, 2009, 11:34:22 PM
The coding that I have yet to do I imagine will take me a few weeks, but I shall let you know when the major outstanding new features are completed, and the continuing coding work will be limited to maintenance and adoption of others' patches. I shall very much look forward to the rest of the Underground things and narrow gauge trains!

Also to be done by somebody at some stage:

* railway bridges;

* splash screen logo;

* ground objects;

* different eras' industries; and

* bus graphics.

As for aircraft, perhaps concentrate on smaller aircraft used for short-haul flights? Even the largest Simutrans maps strike me as too small for intercontinental aviation... ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 06, 2009, 08:55:45 AM
Also to be done by somebody at some stage:

* railway bridges;
* splash screen logo;
* ground objects;
* different eras' industries; and
* bus graphics.

...and all the other stuff on the to-do list post...!!! (more important are things like canals, stops, and the GUI which are preventing a full opensource release).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 06, 2009, 08:17:24 PM
OK, one less thing on the to-do list (re-drawn tunnel) :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 06, 2009, 11:51:24 PM
I really like that!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 07, 2009, 04:05:00 PM
Canal set - including locks on the slopes, a tunnel, and an aqueduct.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: isidoro on March 07, 2009, 04:57:59 PM
Very nice!  I do like it.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 07, 2009, 05:58:52 PM
Goodness me - canals, now, too! You know, once there are canals, people will be able to start a game in 1750 and play for three hundred game years!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on March 07, 2009, 06:10:20 PM
And transport... what?

(I want to see somebody playing that long ;) )
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 07, 2009, 06:15:39 PM
And transport... what?

Coal, iron ore, wood, food...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 07, 2009, 06:52:02 PM
Goodness me - canals, now, too! You know, once there are canals, people will be able to start a game in 1750 and play for three hundred game years!

That is the ultimate plan ;)

Here's an old road tunnel too.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 07, 2009, 06:55:51 PM
Excellent!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: micslu on March 09, 2009, 07:38:38 PM
I've recently read the first 3 Jim Stringer railway detective mysteries (Necropolis Railway, Blackpool Highflyer and Lost Luggage Porter) by Andrew Martin.
These screenshots are giving me good illustration of the railroad and scenery of the period. I hope impenetrable fog and bleak moors follow  :D!
Really good job!!!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 09, 2009, 08:17:36 PM
The Hood, are you doing a "bleak moors" ground object? ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: micslu on March 09, 2009, 08:31:41 PM
I know most of Britain was covered by snow recently but PakBritain should have bleak Gothic moors (ala the Brontes) instead of alpine and desert climes  ;D
And lots of coal mines but offshore oil only!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: mjhn on March 09, 2009, 10:30:24 PM
Go for bleak moors and Fen instead of alpine and desert.
Of course, Britain has onshore oilfields. They are small, but look more like the 'oil field' industries in simutrans than the big Arabian or Russian oilfields do.
When do we get some norrowboats to use on those nice canals?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 10, 2009, 12:29:30 PM
These screenshots are giving me good illustration of the railroad and scenery of the period. I hope impenetrable fog and bleak moors follow  :D!
Really good job!!!
Thanks for the feedback!  The colours are quite dull and bleak anyway, presumably kieron did this to represent cloud cover  :D 
The Hood, are you doing a "bleak moors" ground object? ;-)
Not right away  :P
Go for bleak moors and Fen instead of alpine and desert.
I think climates are hardwired into the game, rather than the pak, but I'm not sure.  Anyway, Kieron set these up and I haven't got the sources, so  not a lot I can do (or that I could do better!)
Quote
Of course, Britain has onshore oilfields. They are small, but look more like the 'oil field' industries in simutrans than the big Arabian or Russian oilfields do.
There should be some small onshore oilfields in the industry set.  They don't appear very often though and will ultimately be set up to be lower output than oil rigs (they all have generic values at the moment).
Quote
When do we get some norrowboats to use on those nice canals?
When someone draws them?  :P

That won't be me for quite some time (see the to-do list, and how far down they are!) but if anyone else wants to have a go, I'm more than willing to help them get started and help you make things that fit the graphics style (e.g. send blender files over for using as a base).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 10, 2009, 10:05:22 PM
I've seen the oil wells - they're nicely done :-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 15, 2009, 10:50:09 AM
This is what has been taking up my time (hence lack of progress in the last week!) - rivers!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 15, 2009, 11:10:52 AM
Very lovely! Are those (and the new trees, and new tunnel entrances) going to make it onto the SVN anytime soon...? :-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: vilvoh on March 15, 2009, 11:45:08 AM
Good work! perhaps they need some rocks and vegetations on river shore, but the shape is perfect.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 15, 2009, 01:32:34 PM
@jamespetts:
They will go on SVN once I've got the rivers appearing in the right place in public player menus - which may take a lot of annoyance with menuconf.tab etc...  I thought the trees were up on SVN, but I noticed that only the conifer was.  I'll update them at the same time.

@vilvoh:
slopes and springs have rocks, but I will investigate some extra vegetation on the banks.  Thing is I'm a bit rivered out at the minute, so it might have to wait!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 17, 2009, 09:09:14 PM
Latest progress:
- Road signals (hopefully you can work out which each one is!): One-way, No entry, Motorway, Choose Sign, Private Sign, Traffic Lights
- Two more road tunnels.

All the recent additions should be on sourceforge now in the SVN.  Note you will need to update simuconf.tab and menuconf.tab for the rivers to work properly.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 17, 2009, 09:23:56 PM
Excellent - it is very encouraging to see the steady progress on PakBritain. Those look lovely, as ever. Incidentally, I was just looking through the simuconf.tab file, and noticed two significant non-standard settings: the station coverage of 4 (default 2) and the passenger level of 8 (default 16). Was there a particular reason for that...?

Edit: Incidentally, I have noticed a bug in the train depots: the introduction date of the newer train depot is given as 1810, which means that they are both available at all times. Perhaps something like 1962 would be suitable?

Edit 2: Also, I should mention: the rivers and oak trees really do look rather splendid in game.

Edit 3: Finally, was there a reason that you did not give retirement dates to the depots? I have added retirement dates in my version, and they work well. It is much better not being able to build the grubby old depot in 2010 ;-)

Edit 4: Another anomaly - the traffic lights and the no entry signs appear in the menus twice for some reason. Also, a number of the signs are duplicated by others from Pak128, but I think that they are bundled with something else necessary for PakBritain to work.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 17, 2009, 10:37:07 PM
Station coverage and passenger level are because I like to play on large maps with large cities, but don't want the uber-congestion from passenger level 16.  Essentially it zooms everything in a bit.  No other reason, and they should probably be changed back to defaults for releases.

Re: edit1/edit3: I keep forgetting to change these!
Re: edit4: delete the any other road signal paks you have (they probably have the same object name and the menu gets confused..., e.g. road_signs.all.pak is no longer needed.)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 17, 2009, 11:22:41 PM
Ahh, excellent, yes, deleting that pak file solved the problem. As to passenger level - that is definitely a good reason for keeping it at a lower level. In fact, if PakBritain is all about simulating conditions in the UK, which is a very densely populated country, I suggest leaving the passenger level where it is, and increasing the default town size and number to simulate British conditions more accurately. The uber-congestion, as you call it, is something that I find quite a drag on gameplay. Indeed, one of the aims of Simutrans-Experimental is to control that somewhat.

As to the station coverage - interesting point about zooming things in. Do you think that there would be any benefit in having different levels of station coverage for different sorts of station, or do you not think that that would be worth it?

Edit: A further glitch - the "improved wooden sleeper" track seems to have been subsumed into "tram track": there seems to be an error in the wssri.dat file giving it the wrong name, which means that only the tram track shows. Also, all the retirement dates for different track types seem to have gone.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 18, 2009, 09:02:25 AM
Thanks for spotting those glitches - I'm really confused how they got there but I will fix them asap.  Keep the bug reports rolling!

As for station coverage etc, default settings can always be played to suit player style.  Increase in station coverage and map size trades off with decrease in passenger level.  For simutrans experimental, just find a combination that works.  For station coverage, I think that it would be good to have different coverages for stations relative to bus stops for example.  Very large railway stations could have larger still catchments.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on March 18, 2009, 09:40:59 AM
I think that the station coverage must be uniform because the activity comes from the other direction - passengers search for stations. I may be wrong though.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 18, 2009, 09:50:29 AM
Actually how far people will walk to reach public transport depends on what type of public transport (part of my job is about modelling this!) - people will not usually walk more than 500m to a bus stop but are prepared to walk much further (maybe 2km) to a train station (in the UK at least, but then here trains are generally seen as a good form of transport and buses are avoided unless absolutely necessary!).
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on March 18, 2009, 10:35:09 AM
Oh well, but in the game it's all the same. Plus if you wanted to change that, you can have a station combined with bus stop, and afaik it only indicates whether it has route to target or not, but the kind is not so easily accessible. And it seems strange to toss away passengers only after they successfully find the stop.

Tunnels are nice - similar texture to the walls in city makes them look part of the wall, too.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Alex. Brose on March 18, 2009, 10:44:08 AM
Are the facades in GB really so dark?
But it fits great to the proximity.

I think some graphics could be more sharpen.

I'm looking forward to the release. :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 19, 2009, 11:07:37 PM
Alex, I think it's to do with the clouds - the sun never gets through so it's dark  :D

Anyway, these should complete the depot timeline for bus and water:
- modern bus depot
- coach stables (really old bus depot!)
- old boatyard
- modern boatyard
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 19, 2009, 11:13:15 PM
I love those depots! The idea of a coach yard is particularly appealing! In SVN anytime soon...? :-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Alex. Brose on March 20, 2009, 06:09:31 AM
Alex, I think it's to do with the clouds - the sun never gets through so it's dark  :D
You're not going to believe this, The Hood: This thought has crossed my mind.

Just carry on! :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on March 20, 2009, 06:52:45 AM
Love those depots :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 21, 2009, 01:29:11 PM
Here are some road stops:
1st screenshot: basic bus stop with bench, old bus shelter, modern bus shelter, and a delivery bay with post box (handles goods and mail, low capacity).
2nd screenshot: old and modern higher capacity goods stops

I do hope to add som terminal bus stops at some stage, but I'd quite like to use some of the bits from Kieron's rail stations in them, and I don't have the sources yet, so I think that's it on road stops for now.

Everything up on SVN, including new depots and corrected retire years on track.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 21, 2009, 01:37:08 PM
Very nice! This is some lovely progress...

Edit: On testing, I notice that none of the 'bus stops have introduction or retirement dates - is that intentional?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 21, 2009, 03:13:52 PM
Oh yeah, forgot to add those in after testing.  The post box and the basic bus stop are available all the time, the other two go in pairs and change over in 1950.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 21, 2009, 03:21:55 PM
Here is what I have done with my copy:

Code: [Select]
Obj=building
Name=BusStop
# must be 1*1
type=stop
waytype=road
intro_year=1700
intro_month=4
noconstruction=1
enables_pax=1
NoInfo=1
Dims=1,1,2
level=1
BackImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=basic-bus-stop.0.0
FrontImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=basic-bus-stop.0.1
BackImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=basic-bus-stop.0.2
FrontImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=basic-bus-stop.0.3
icon=> basic-bus-stop.0.5
cursor=basic-bus-stop.0.4
--------------------
Obj=building
Name=OldBusShelter
# must be 1*1
type=stop
waytype=road
intro_year=1825
intro_month=6
retire_year=1952
retire_month=5
noconstruction=1
enables_pax=1
NoInfo=1
Dims=1,1,2
level=2
BackImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=old-bus-shelter.0.0
FrontImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=old-bus-shelter.0.1
BackImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=old-bus-shelter.0.2
FrontImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=old-bus-shelter.0.3
icon=> old-bus-shelter.0.5
cursor=old-bus-shelter.0.4
--------------------
Obj=building
Name=ModernBusShelter
# must be 1*1
type=stop
waytype=road
intro_year=1952
intro_month=2
enables_pax=1
NoInfo=1
noconstruction=1
Dims=1,1,2
level=2
BackImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=modern-bus-shelter.0.0
FrontImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=modern-bus-shelter.0.1
BackImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=modern-bus-shelter.0.2
FrontImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=modern-bus-shelter.0.3
icon=> modern-bus-shelter.0.5
cursor=modern-bus-shelter.0.4
--------------------
Obj=building
Name=LoadingBay
# must be 1*1
type=stop
waytype=road
intro_year=1700
intro_month=4
noconstruction=1
enables_post=1
enables_ware=1
NoInfo=1
Dims=1,1,2
level=1
BackImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=loading-bay.0.0
FrontImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=-
BackImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=loading-bay.0.1
FrontImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=-
icon=> loading-bay.0.2
cursor=loading-bay.0.1
--------------------
Obj=building
Name=OldCargoStop
# must be 1*1
type=stop
waytype=road
intro_year=1825
intro_month=6
retire_year=1952
retire_month=5
Dims=1,1,4
enables_post=1
enables_ware=1
noconstruction=1
level=4
NoInfo=1
retire_year=1950
BackImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.0.0
FrontImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.1.0
BackImage[3][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.0.1
FrontImage[3][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.1.1
BackImage[2][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.0.2
FrontImage[2][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.1.2
BackImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.0.3
FrontImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-old.1.3
icon=> cargo-terminal-old.1.4
cursor=cargo-terminal-old.0.4
--------------------
Obj=building
Name=ModernCargoStop
# must be 1*1
type=stop
waytype=road
intro_year=1952
intro_month=2
Dims=1,1,4
enables_post=1
enables_ware=1
noconstruction=1
level=4
NoInfo=1
retire_year=1950
BackImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.0.0
FrontImage[0][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.1.0
BackImage[3][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.0.1
FrontImage[3][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.1.1
BackImage[2][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.0.2
FrontImage[2][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.1.2
BackImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.0.3
FrontImage[1][0][0][0][0][0]=cargo-terminal-modern.1.3
icon=> cargo-terminal-modern.1.4
cursor=cargo-terminal-modern.0.4
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 21, 2009, 05:07:15 PM
...
Current progress is like this:
- British rail set - complete passenger and bulk goods timeline 1750-2010, patchy mail timeline 1830-2010, no other goods vehicles
- British tram set - complete tram set 1860-2010
- British bus set - only a handful of complete vehicles but some dats from Jamespetts
- Britsish citybuildings - town halls, some attractions, and citybuildings.  Completely playable but may lead to slightly monotonous cities with the timeline on.
- British industry set and goods set - works well without timeline on, but limited if you have timeline on.
- British grounds - complete set of graphically consistent grounds that match the rest of the pak.
- British rails and roads - several types of rail and two types of road - only one rail bridge so far and no tunnels.
- British stations - several types of rail station.

Future priorities are as follows, with the aim of getting a standalone release ready:
- Trees
- Fences
- Signals
- Electrification
- Ways for tram, canal, river.
- Depots for all transport types
- Bus stations, canal stations.

I think that some of the things in the "to do" need now to be moved to the "done" ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 21, 2009, 09:41:25 PM
I'd forgotten I'd made a list in two threads!  I've removed the to-do list from this thread, and it's all now in the to-do list thread.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 21, 2009, 09:45:05 PM
Good idea ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 23, 2009, 09:53:23 PM
Bus terminals old and modern...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 23, 2009, 10:17:21 PM
Excellent! Ohh, the joys of concrete bunkers... ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 24, 2009, 10:30:00 PM
Some canal quays (old and modern passenger, goods), and an old passenger and old goods docks.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Alex. Brose on March 24, 2009, 10:42:02 PM
Wow. Wow. Wow.

I'm wondering if you could add staircases to the old goods dock.
Or portals in the brick wall? :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 24, 2009, 11:19:13 PM
Very nice!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 25, 2009, 09:04:57 AM
Good idea Alex, I'll work on it.  I should say that the passenger building is mostly a re-rendered version of Kieron's rail station building dumped on top of a basic harbour layout I drew, just in case I was taking too much credit for that!  Good stuff should be used more than once in my opinion!

Edit: how's this look for the stairs?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on March 25, 2009, 06:02:59 PM
Maybe some railings? Would it be possible to reduce the tiling artifacts with the textures?
But cool :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 25, 2009, 06:34:30 PM
Kieron, I'll see what I can do to those.  In the meantime, several new bits:
-modern goods dock (suffers from same lack of railings!)
-modern passenger dock
-modern station extension building
-goods station with basic siding, crane, and fluid storage extension
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on March 25, 2009, 06:38:29 PM
These docks are great! If I knew it would not break the looks even more, I'd steal them for "my set" on the spot.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 25, 2009, 08:06:12 PM
*Drool* Excellent! I especially like the freight terminal... I can only imagine how good that the post office will look... ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Alex. Brose on March 25, 2009, 10:37:27 PM
Edit: how's this look for the stairs?
Well done! :)

Like them.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 26, 2009, 11:10:35 AM
The dock now complies with health and safety regulations, and they have fitted railings to the staircase :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 26, 2009, 11:15:45 AM
Very nice! I notice that - realistically - you have only done this for the modern dock ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 26, 2009, 03:57:58 PM
Actually it's also on the old dock, but it looks the same so only one screenshot.  Lots more goods station bits - here's two screenshots of an old and a modern goods station - see how many bits you can spot!

Regarding post office extensions, I'm not sure how to draw them.  Anyone got any good ideas?  Otherwise, I was thinking of allowing the passenger rail station extension buildings, and the generic warehouse extensions to also allow post.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 26, 2009, 10:43:46 PM
Looking good - cunning re-use of graphics ;-) Perhaps, though, in order to avoid possible confusion with the depots, the colours could be changed a tad - perhaps red brick for the older ones, and, say, green or red doors for the newer ones?

As to post offices, perhaps something like this: http://fp.martinunderwood.f9.co.uk/Ladykillers/images/large/Cheney_Road.jpg ?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: Alex. Brose on March 26, 2009, 10:49:05 PM
By the way, The Hood... Don't forget red call boxes for the townscape.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on March 26, 2009, 11:14:36 PM
Wow :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 27, 2009, 01:08:29 PM
Cunning re-use of graphics is very much in at the minute... (a goods way of producing things quickly with graphical consistency!!!)

Some more cunning re-use of graphics (I'm getting a bit carried away with making stations, but never mind...)
- Country station extension building
- Modern small station extension building
- Wooden station (developed from a blend Kieron made but never finished - hope that's OK Kieron!)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 27, 2009, 03:58:05 PM
I love those! A modern post office could easily be just like the modern station extension, with different colours...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: micslu on March 27, 2009, 06:34:37 PM
Shouldn't there be pubs with kegs lying around next the stations  :D
Looking forward to more impressive stuffs!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 27, 2009, 07:03:16 PM
Here are the post offices and also powerlines.  The transformers are actually new, but the powerlines are a shameless rip off from pak128 (with credits of course!) with some messing around with the colours to make them fit pakBritain better.  All the stations are now in SVN (powerlines aren't yet).

Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 27, 2009, 11:17:49 PM
I like!

Edit: There is a missing file from the SVN - ../stations/concrete-platform-cursor.png.

Edit 2: Also missing from the SVN are the intermediate era stations - the ones with the green canopies, in between your new wooden stations and the existing concrete stations (which both are in the SVN). Also - should a station extension building really have the same capacity as a single platform tile? Should it not have a higher capacity?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 28, 2009, 10:55:00 AM
Thanks for the bug reports - I knew I'd miss some!  Which files are missing in your edit 2?  I think they are all there...

Regarding capacities, I didn't think much about them, so if you want to propose some values that can be one of your non-graphical contributions to the set :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 28, 2009, 11:11:12 AM
Oops - I realised that the second edit related to my mistake in not copying a file. Edit 1 is still correct. And I'll bear that in mind about the station capacities - I think that I'll probably work on pakset balancing generally (using PakBritain-Experimental, but much of the work could easily be backported into PakBritain-Standard) when testing the new revenue model.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 28, 2009, 06:03:49 PM
I was hoping to steal the smokes from pak128 but apparently these haven't got open source permission, so I'm drawing my own.  How about these?  (they may also get used in pak128 too, subject to VS's approval!)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 28, 2009, 06:11:52 PM
Very nice - I like the shape! Could they be just a tad darker? (I assume that the locomotive was going very fast when that picture was taken - how would it look if the locomotive was going more slowly with your smoke shapes?)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 28, 2009, 06:15:39 PM
It looks like this:
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 28, 2009, 06:58:16 PM
Very real:
(http://www.thecottagekentallen.co.uk/photos/Jacobite-SteamTrain.jpg)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 28, 2009, 07:11:12 PM
Very hard to draw smoke like that in simutrans!  I've changed the alignment slightly, which should make it better, but it's always going to be "blobby" at speed with the frequency that smoke is created in the game.  I've also done diesel smokes.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 28, 2009, 07:16:00 PM
Actually, the picture was supposed to be a compliment, as it was very close! Ahh, that diesel one is nice. You might need a slightly thicker one for the Deltic, though ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: vilvoh on March 28, 2009, 07:31:59 PM
Are you using Blender or are you drawing it by hand? to get a realistic smoke, I suggest you to use Blender particle system.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 28, 2009, 08:06:33 PM
That was hand-drawn.  Where is the particle thingy in blender?  Sounds useful...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: vilvoh on March 28, 2009, 11:21:16 PM
Have a look at these links:
  • Realistic smoke in Blender (http://b3d.mezon.ru/index.php/Realistic_Smoke_in_Blender)
  • Blender Magazine #20 (http://www.blenderart.org/issues/)
  • Blender particles system (Newtonian Physics) (http://www.blender.org/development/release-logs/blender-246/particles/newtonian-physics/)
  • Boob to Pro: Making fire (http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Blender_3D:_Noob_to_Pro/Making_Fire)

It's pretty easy. You create an particle emiter, set up the amount, speed, life-time, etc..and then bake the animation.

Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: kierongreen on March 30, 2009, 11:42:45 AM
Of course reusing unfinished blends is fine! :)

Progress looks good :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: VS on March 30, 2009, 12:36:34 PM
I got permission for the smokes... /happy dance
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on March 30, 2009, 01:07:31 PM
Oh OK, that's cool.  Seeing as I have done smokes anyway, which ones do people think are best for pakBritain?  I can pre-release the sources for my smokes if people want to test?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on March 30, 2009, 02:31:17 PM
I have to say, I quite like The Hood's, especially the diesel one.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on April 02, 2009, 09:09:49 PM
Quieter week on PakBritain development, but still time for some modern airport bits (planes courtesy of Zeno's plane pak, not pakBritain planes yet!)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on April 02, 2009, 09:20:23 PM
Nice!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on April 08, 2009, 07:44:57 PM
Now you can build big ugly concrete monstrosity stations in pakBritain, meaning you can replicate the architectural delights of Birmingham New Street, Euston and Heathrow Airport...
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on April 08, 2009, 08:32:21 PM
Ugly concrete monstrosities - excellent! I wondered what you'd been working on all this time... And they all look more or less the same - very realistic!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on April 09, 2009, 07:45:14 AM
Actually I've not had quite so much time recently, so that's why things have slowed down.  I've got a few other things to do, plus it's nearly summer so more time outside and away from the computer!  I'll still be working on things though, just not as fast.

And the reason they all look the same is they essentially are the same :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on April 09, 2009, 07:50:53 AM
Ahh, well, they're good in any case. Any chance of an SVN upload any time soon? And do excuse me if I secretly hope for a very wet summer... ;-)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on April 11, 2009, 02:20:50 PM
An art deco-inspired station building in airport, dock, and station guises.  The airport also has a grass runway and taxiway, and an old-style hangar.  I think that should just about do it for airports and stations in general for now :)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on April 11, 2009, 02:51:07 PM
Very nice indeed! That looks like a lot of work went into it. Any chance of an SVN update any time soon?
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: derajjared on April 12, 2009, 03:23:47 AM
magnifico edificios
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: IgorEliezer on April 12, 2009, 05:27:32 AM
magnifico edificios

In English boards, posts in English Language are needed. ::)
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on April 12, 2009, 02:29:11 PM
In English boards, posts in English Language are needed. ::)

I think even I can guess what it means, so thankyou! 

@jamespetts - SVN release once I've tidied a few things up.
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: jamespetts on April 12, 2009, 02:35:26 PM
Excellent - shall look forward.  Happy Easter!
Title: Re: PakBritain - Releases and progress
Post by: The Hood on April 14, 2009, 09:21:21 PM
OK, I've uploaded everything now.  I think that should make a standalone set of pakBritain objects.  Could someone please try making a complete fresh pakset from the SVN sources and let me know if it works, or if anything is missing (doubtless I've forgotten something!).  Note that the sources in gui128/ need to have one pak file per dat file, and the sources in gui64/ need to be made with makeobj pak64/

Thanks