The International Simutrans Forum

Community => Game Servers => Topic started by: moblet on August 15, 2011, 01:04:15 PM

Title: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 15, 2011, 01:04:15 PM
Game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk will be uploaded soon.

It runs r4359 (110.0.1 stable) with openpak128 nightly, same as for game #1 and also as used on server 128.simutrans.entropy.me.uk (http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=6548.0).

The pak can be downloaded here: http://entropy.me.uk/simutrans/simupakopen128-1150.zip

This server is accessible via both IPv4 and IPv6.

This game will be played using a set of territories and rules, see them here (http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=7824.0).

All players in this game have been locked. To join the game, post in this thread and a game admin will send you a password by PM. When posting, say which territory you would like and whether you want to move goods, passengers/mail, or both. You can also request a player colour if you wish (you can view these in the player list in the game).
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 15, 2011, 02:22:01 PM
I am confused. No reply in this thread yet, but obviously 7 players are playing heavily. What did I misunderstood...?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 15, 2011, 02:29:26 PM
The new game has not been started yet. If you are looking at a well developed game it will be the old game #1. Timothy plans to upload it later, but I will be asleep then so I have posted this now.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 15, 2011, 02:34:33 PM
Ah, so I am watching the old game. Sorry for the buzz. Some questions:

- Will the server be shut down at night?

- Is it possible to found teams? If yes, I'd rather like to join one.

- Is there any aim to reach? When will the game end?

I like the map and the rules, especially collaboration and realism. My problem is time. Feeling responsible for an online territory sucks time. That's why I am asking in that way.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on August 15, 2011, 02:41:59 PM
Hi,
There's no aim to reach  ;)  Or maybe one : enjoy playing !
The game will end when Timothy will upload the new map, because the current one was a test for rules, players and map.
But in the future, a game can end if the map become unplayable, if there's too much industries,... Or if nobody play it anymore.
I don't know what you mean by team, but all players on the same map are in the same team  ;) Maybe we can say there's another goal :
Co-operate with others.
The server will never shut down, except for problem, uploading of a new map,...

Your problem is time, we have all the same problem : I'm working on a map, 640x640, it's big, but with a lot of players, you'll administrate a territory, and you can choose to do freight and/or passengers, passengers will need less time I think  ;)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 15, 2011, 02:49:16 PM
Guilllaume, thanks!

Fore sure all players will form a team, somehow. We did it in the same way at the first tests last year.
I like that way of playing.

Next questions:

- Are you usually sharing passwords to avoid problems in time of absence?

- Can you tell some details about the config, especially critical things like overcrowding, private traffic, a.s.o.?

BTW: I looked half an hour on that map and only now I recognized Switzerland. ; - )
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Fifty on August 15, 2011, 03:05:13 PM
Hello Rainer,

All of the admins have all passwords that are needed for administration. We all live in different time zones, so one of us is almost always awake, if not online.

Config: (Moblet, correct me if I'm wrong)
-No city cars
-city growth reduced to 5%
-(perhaps) industry_increase_every increased from 5000 to 6000-8000.
-standard overcrowding settings (no modifications from standard settings)

I think what you mean by teams is that 2 people could share one player in one region. I would be very happy to do this with someone, particularly if someone wants to do pax in the same region I do freight. I think this might work well; we could at least try one region with a team.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on August 15, 2011, 03:06:26 PM
In the previous game, only moblet and me were sharing passwords  ;) On the current, we're not really playing moblet and me, it's a test.
I hope that in the future we'll share passwords, it's very useful to fix problems like : too much trucks on this line, not enough here,..., or to solve our nightmare : the traffic jams.
From my experience : traffic jams were a nightmare, but we solved the problem ( not on the current map ) : by deleting cars  ;)
Overcrowding is good at start, but when you've to manage 2 millions people, it's impossible ( This was my main problem on the previous game), so I think to set a limit of population for all cities ( not the same, depending of landscape, industries,...), is it a good solution ?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 15, 2011, 03:08:42 PM
Sorry, I was'nt clear enough. I did not ask about admins. Next try:

At your server, do the _players_ share their passwords usually?

We did that in our test games. If someone is absent, but in his erea something is going wrong, which affects the entire game, a coworker can fix the problem. That's what is is about.

[edit] Guillaume was faster. Thanks. ; - )

[edit] Ok, I would like to give it a try. Give me the territory/job you prefer.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 15, 2011, 03:14:57 PM
- Will the server be shut down at night?
No, like all online games the game will continue to run 24/7.
- Is it possible to found teams? If yes, I'd rather like to join one.
We are at a very early stage and still experimenting with principles and rules. Formal teams is an interesting idea and one we can try in a future game. Can you tell us how your teams worked before? In the meantime there is nothing to stop you sharing your password with one or more others and having your player operated by more than one person.
- Is there any aim to reach? When will the game end?
Not yet, just to develop the map and co-ordinate with the other players. Feel free to make suggestions.
I like the map and the rules, especially collaboration and realism. My problem is time. Feeling responsible for an online territory sucks time. That's why I am asking in that way.
I hear you! These games need to be playable by people with limited time. We have tried to turn off city cars and slow the city growth rate by 95% and also the industry growth rate for game #2, I hope we have succeeded. In any case we will use these slower growth parameters in building future maps. Otherwise I think our config parameters are the default values, just_in_time is on, routing overcrowding buttons are off, if you have recommendations for parameters please share them.

Our three admins, who are in different time zones, can act as the public player and intervene to change your infrastructure in your absence. In this game we can also identify each player in the forum, so if something is going seriously wrong with your player we can send you a PM to inform you. If you like the rules and co-operative play, then we want you in the game and will help you as much as we can. We would like to build a culture on this server where players would share their passwords in that way, but it is new, this is only game #2. On the other multiplayer servers I have seen, many players are locked in direct competition and sharing passwords is not part of the culture. In the meantime feel free to place a sign at the opening scene, post, and/or PM the admins your password to check and maybe fix anything you are concerned about.

Guillaume, I tried to delete city cars on this map, we will soon know if I succeeded...
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Xelofino on August 15, 2011, 04:07:35 PM
This sounds very interesting to me. I would really like to give it a try. Two problems. First of all, the same as rainer has, not much time. At the moment i'm still in holidays and can't access Simutrans very soon (just about 18th). And at 21th School starts so then time will be rare. Second problem is, that i mostly just play with pak.german. But i think if someone just explains me a bit the balancing, the history or the best way to start in pak128 i would give it a try. If rainer is really unsure about participating than i would even cooperate with him, and play as one company (if he wants to).
Some Questions : Why did you make such huge Cities at the start of the game? Who chose these crazy citynames?  ;D and Is that yellow thing the motorway which can only be accessed at these exits?

If i play, i choose North, Passenger/Mail.

Xelofino
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on August 15, 2011, 05:05:38 PM
I think I want to operate the South, both passengers and freight.
Xelofino, these cities are not very huge  ;)
On this map moblet choosed the names.
Yes the yellow thing is old taxiways protecting motorways from players and cities.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 15, 2011, 07:21:36 PM
I think I want to play West. Freight, passanger, or both is ok.
However, as another player here, I usually only have a little time (few hours) to play a day.
Whatever colour.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Xelofino on August 15, 2011, 07:35:24 PM
Few hours, little time? I have (in best case) 2 hour/day but in worst case nothing. Average 30 minutes to 1 hour. This time is about 19 o clock to 21 (GMT +2 if i'm right). I think i will give it a try and take north as i said before and just ppassengers/mail. Could somebody make a realllyy short summary in p.s (2-3 sentences) about how i should play pak128? Just to know the structure. I will surely make a testgame for me and try things out but more advanced players could give me hints that i don't have to begin at the start. I would be glad :)

Xelofino

P.S: When does it start? (Servergame and ingameyear)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Fifty on August 15, 2011, 08:51:22 PM
The game will start in real life as soon as Timothy Restarts the server.

Game time, the server will start in 1930, but obey era/timeline is off (all vehicles can be purchased).

@Vonjo, may I ask what your nick has been in prior netgames (if you have played)?

@Xelofino, I am no expert, but here is what I can say about pak 128. It is quite different than pak.german. In the german pak, running costs are quite high and maintenance is quite low. In 128, maintenance costs are quite high and running costs quite low. All of your convoys can turn a profit and you can still go bankrupt. In pak.german, there is no speedbonus. In 128, speedbonus is very important for passengers, mail, and many finished goods. In 128, you can make lots of money and impressive margins of 70-80%, but starting is much harder. There are some buses and trains that are better than others, just look at the netgames to see the ones people use. For the most part, diesel and hydrogen trains are best for freight, and electrics for passengers. If this is your first time playing 128, you might want to experiment on the other 128 server a bit first to see how to best start a game. I usually start with fast trains on slow tracks for freight or pax to upgrade track later, or with small bus networks.

I would like to play East, Freight only. If someone wants to partner with me to do pax and supervise the network that would be great.

Please let us know definitively if you want to play and what/where you would like to do so we can send you the password and you can start playing once the server is restarted!
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 15, 2011, 09:10:55 PM
EDIT : Sorry. Double post delete this.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 15, 2011, 09:17:00 PM
@Vonjo, may I ask what your nick has been in prior netgames (if you have played)?
I was on 128.entropy server as purple from savegame 18 april to 31 may.
Was on 64.entropy server too twice but i'm forget. usually as purple too.
Whether you believe me or not...

http://entropy.me.uk/simutrans/networksavegames/sim128/
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 05:38:53 AM
Why did you make such huge Cities at the start of the game?
Because of the constraints of the territories and the choice of transport task (goods vs pax), and because different players have different preferences and different amounts of time available, we wanted to make a map that could suit all these different players at once, and for which it is possible to make a profit on passenger service from the very beginning.

Timothy has loaded the map but the server is not responding at present. I have sent him a message to let him know.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Xelofino on August 16, 2011, 05:59:22 AM
Ok, i understand. You know, im very fixed, that in pak.german you start with tiny villages which grow extremly fast but here it is totaly inversed.

I want to participate, North, Passenger/Mail, Colour:Blue or green.

Only problem as i said before, i will only be able to start playing on 18th. If this is too late than you can give my place to someone else  :).
@Fifty: Thanks for the Summary. I will try to start bankruptless :P.

Xelofino
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 16, 2011, 07:58:00 AM
New map should be online now, let me know if the server is still not responding. Sometimes when starting up the game hangs when loading the map.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 16, 2011, 08:16:17 AM
Quote from: moblet (in game)
yes, but i think we should make vonjo choose either goods or pax
as both would be a big task
Goods first. :)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 08:36:16 AM
Thanks Timothy, the server is working now.

Xelofino and Vonjo, you have both been sent passwords by PM to join the game.

The territory assignments are:
North
Pax/mail: Xelofino
Goods: free
South
Pax/mail: Guillaume (as SNCFS & Freight)
Goods: Guillaume (as SNCFS & Freight)
East
Pax/mail: moblet (as Mobilet)
Goods: Fifty
West
Pax/mail: free
Goods: Vonjo

We currently have two spaces remaining for players to join.
rainer, tell us which remaining territory/task combination and colour you want and we will send you a password to join the game.

When setting your player name, consider placing a tag so other players can see your task from the player list (e.g. W pax for "West passengers & mail")
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 16, 2011, 11:08:46 AM
rainer, tell us which remaining territory/task combination and colour you want

I don't care. Just give me a job. ; - )
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on August 16, 2011, 11:18:44 AM
We will not choose for you, choose and then play  ;)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yoshi on August 16, 2011, 01:08:40 PM
I want to take North and operate freight services.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 01:26:06 PM
Yoshi has now been assigned player 8 to transport freight in the North territory.
rainer has now been assigned player 7 to transport passengers and mail in the West territory.

All places in this game are now filled. If anyone leaves the game their place will be made available to a new player.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 16, 2011, 03:30:08 PM
Went in the game. Logged in at Player 7. Can't do anything. Am I aysnchron? No error message, nothing...

[Edit] Ok, I am not asynchron, but have an unacceptable delay. Unplayable so far.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 03:47:16 PM
Try restarting Simutrans now and seeing if it works. It's possible my installation was locking you out, as I hadn't restarted Simutrans since setting your password.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 16, 2011, 03:57:02 PM
Ok, restarting reduced the delay from 2 or 3 minutes to some 10 seconds. Anythings else I can do?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 03:58:47 PM
So it's a lag problem you're having? Are you on Linux?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 16, 2011, 04:01:19 PM
Linux version 2.6.32-5-686-bigmem (Debian 2.6.32-31)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 04:03:26 PM
I had major lag using the Linux version on Ubuntu, I believe this is normal. The Windows versions don't lag much but are more prone to desyncs. Are you able to use a Windows version? Keep both the GDI and SDL versions handy and use whichever is better behaved on the day.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 16, 2011, 04:06:47 PM
Are you able to use a Windows version?

No way.

Sorry folks, it was an interesting test, but for me it has its end here.

@all: Have fun in the game!
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 16, 2011, 04:15:57 PM
OK, sorry you had problems, and thanks for trying. I don't know if any of the tech experts have any ideas on why the Linux version has lag issues.

This means that West passengers & mail is available if anyone wishes to join the game.

Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 18, 2011, 06:13:13 AM
Ok, restarting reduced the delay from 2 or 3 minutes to some 10 seconds. Anythings else I can do?
What spec machine are you running? Vonjo runs Linux and says it lags if he runs it on a slower machine (e.g. P4), which is what I was doing also.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 18, 2011, 06:30:24 AM
Yes. I have no problem with linux version.
Your lag maybe caused by a slow machine, not operating system problem.
When I use pentium4 computer, it can take 1-5 minutes to respond, both windows and linux.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 18, 2011, 07:46:14 AM
You might also want to try increasing the value of the "additional_client_frames_behind" setting in simuconf.tab, as this can help with latency issues on the client side. I already have the server equivalent set higher than the default.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 18, 2011, 04:39:33 PM
What spec machine are you running?

cat /proc/cpuinfo

vendor_id       : GenuineIntel
cpu family      : 15
model           : 2
model name      : Intel(R) Xeon(TM) CPU 2.40GHz
stepping        : 7
cpu MHz         : 2399.741
cache size      : 512 KB
(...)

The machine has four of these CPUs (which won't help as Simutrans doesn't multitask).

cat /proc/meminfo

MemTotal:        6234832 kB
(...)

It is an old server. Believe me, it is strong enough. ;-)
Last year I did several stress tests for James (ST Exp) parallel without any hickup.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 18, 2011, 04:40:30 PM
You might also want to try increasing the value of the "additional_client_frames_behind" (...)

Which value would you recommend?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 18, 2011, 04:41:08 PM
Try 8.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 18, 2011, 04:43:05 PM
Try 8.

Are you sure? It is 256 now...

[Edit] Forget it. Messed the values. Sorry.
 
[Edit] [ x ] changed value

I will give it another try when I am sitting at that machine. At the moment I am on the
road with a laptop and UMTS connection. No chance for now.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 18, 2011, 04:44:23 PM
Really? The default is zero, are you sure you checked "additional_client_frames_behind"?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 18, 2011, 05:30:16 PM
Due to a hm... "interesting" thunderstorm I prefered to leave the park and went back to the office. Can't login at the game for testing as the password is changed meanwhile.

BTW: Did you ever thought about using #simutrans on irc.quakenet.org for all this kind of communication? Using the inline chat before login is not possible, and all the marks on the map... Well... ; - )

[Edit] Got new data. Logged in.

~/simutrans/config/simuconf.tab

additional_client_frames_behind = 8

Lag some 30 to 60 seconds. Still unplayable. Any more hints?

[Edit] Tried the values 12, 16 and 4 as well. Can't value the effect (if existing).
I will try to "rescue" the company in any way now. ; - )
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Xelofino on August 18, 2011, 08:42:08 PM
So i joined succesfully, set name, set password. I will start a bit slowly because of my little knowledge about pak.128 . I look forward to a cool network game  :).

Xelofino
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on August 18, 2011, 09:25:15 PM
All tests with other values of additional_client_frames_behind haven't shown any result.
(It might be that the lag was 2 instead of 4 minutes or the like. I didn't measerud precisely.)

Workaround: I am doing some clicks, leave the game and reconnect. This is faster than waiting. : - /

Another strange effect: Obviosly the game is displayed at my client relevant slower (some 30 - 50%)
than normally. When I am wating some minutes, and reconnect, I do a "jump" in time.

Something's going wrong...

Any hints are welcome.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 19, 2011, 05:09:32 AM
Another strange effect: Obviosly the game is displayed at my client relevant slower (some 30 - 50%)
than normally. When I am wating some minutes, and reconnect, I do a "jump" in time.
Looks like your machine is too slow.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 20, 2011, 09:48:28 AM
I've just downloaded Simutrans 110 yesterday (after playing 102 for an year or so), and saw the new multiplayer feature. This server seems great to me, but (fix me if I'm wrong) it is already full (just logged in and saw the sign...).
Would it be possible to reserve a place in the next game you plan to create, if you do plan to do that?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 20, 2011, 10:59:15 AM
Would it be possible to reserve a place in the next game you plan to create, if you do plan to do that?
Of course. We can make as many regions as we have players up to the technical limit. We started this game for a maximum of eight because there were only three of us at first and we didn't know how many would want to join such a game. If we know the number of players for game #3 before we start, then that makes planning easier.

Game #2 is going well and we may be staying with it for some time, so if you would like to join in somehow, I would like to help. I am happy to give you some of my territory (East passengers, purple) if you would like that, but first, are any players in this game overloaded and want to give some work to a new player?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 20, 2011, 11:46:55 AM
Sure - I'd be happy to join this one. However, I am leaving home for a week tomorrow, so I'd rather join when I return on Friday. Would that be okay? (This would also leave other players the option to state they prefer giving some of their territory).
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 20, 2011, 12:23:48 PM
No problem. Post here when you get back and we'll work it out from there.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 26, 2011, 10:39:33 AM
Ok, I'm back :)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 26, 2011, 11:15:10 AM
Have assigned you Player 3 and sent your password by PM. See you there!
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 26, 2011, 12:39:09 PM
Can't send you a PM for some reason so posting here - I can't log in. I've downloaded the pak-set, but when typing the server address (moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk) it claims it uses pak64 and doesn't let me join. Any ideas what's wrong?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 26, 2011, 12:46:47 PM
That's not the full server address. If you check "Show all" you should see it in the list, otherwise the full server name is moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk:13357

I'm getting no response from the server at present, hopefully you'll do better.

PM's are disabled by default due to problems that were had in the past. If you want to send them you need to request (http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=4996.0) they be enabled for your account.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 26, 2011, 12:49:34 PM
Also not getting response, will try again later. Thanks for clarifying.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 26, 2011, 01:01:43 PM
Sorry the server has crashed and won't restart with the existing savegame. My guess is that the savegame has been corrupted (this happens every so often, especially with games which have been running for a couple of weeks and have been played a lot...)

Savegame is here:

http://entropy.me.uk/simutrans/server13357-network.sve

See if you can load it locally, or it may help to diagnose issues.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 26, 2011, 01:08:34 PM
Thanks Timothy. It won't open for me either. Nothing to do but start planning game #3, I guess...

Would it be possible to implement a system of alternating save names so that when this happens we can revert to the (n-1)th save?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 26, 2011, 01:13:53 PM
That would mean a code change to the game, but I don't see any reason why that wouldn't be possible to implement (maybe save each successive savegame in order, e.g. server<port>-network.sve, server<port>-network-1.sve, server<port>-network-2.sve etc.) Of course it'd need to rotate the saves too. Not impossible, after I finish rewriting the server listing stuff I'll take a look at this.

The log file is here in case someone wants to look into the cause of the crash:

http://entropy.me.uk/simutrans/simmoblet.log

Oh and I can start the server up again from the original save if you'd like for now?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on August 26, 2011, 01:16:36 PM
I can't open it too  ::'(
Moblet's idea would be very good.
Moblet, for the game #3, I did a map just before starting the game #2, it's not finished, but almost ( several industries connections to add, public signs,...), I'll not start a new thread without your permission, I'm a little bored of the swiss map  ;)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 26, 2011, 01:55:24 PM
Oh and I can start the server up again from the original save if you'd like for now?
Hold off for now thanks as we need to discuss and change some parameters, and will send you a new savegame.
Moblet, for the game #3, I did a map just before starting the game #2, it's not finished, but almost ( several industries connections to add, public signs,...), I'll not start a new thread without your permission, I'm a little bored of the swiss map  ;)
I am also interested in having a range of good maps for netgames (I've been working on one too) but would like to run game #3 on the Swiss map again for the reason that we should learn as much as we can from this design before we develop more maps. I'm pretty sure Fifty feels the same way, especially as he did most of the work for the Swiss map. You should not get too bored if you work in a different territory ;) In the meantime I suggest showing your map on the forum for input from other players so we have it ready before we need it.

I will open a thread for game #3.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 26, 2011, 01:58:26 PM
I can't open it too  ::'(
Moblet's idea would be very good.
Moblet, for the game #3, I did a map just before starting the game #2, it's not finished, but almost ( several industries connections to add, public signs,...), I'll not start a new thread without your permission, I'm a little bored of the swiss map  ;)
Ok, may I know what pak is it?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yoshi on August 26, 2011, 02:15:02 PM
I have a savegame which was saved about 24 hours ago. Can the savegame be used to continue the game on the server?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on August 26, 2011, 03:39:31 PM
That's a good new Yoshi !
Can you upload it ?

Vonjo: pak128
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 26, 2011, 03:47:00 PM
Thanks, Guillaume

@Yoshi: Great. Can you upload it? For my archive. I feel bad, because I lost my hard work... (Forgot to save it for backup) :D
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Fifty on August 26, 2011, 04:25:31 PM
Fixed. Here's the save, working again:

http://simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/server13357-network-fixed.sve (http://simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/server13357-network-fixed.sve)

The save opened fine using nightly r4781. I opened it, changed the savegame version back to 110.1, and saved again. Presto! It works again with stable!

Timothy, provided it works for you, I think put this save online...
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 26, 2011, 04:28:07 PM
Thanks Fifty, I'll remember that trick for next time. Server is back up and running again :)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: derajjared on August 26, 2011, 07:40:52 PM
good morning I want to play but so link is no longer anything., could put back the link to download the pak needed please

the password can be provided
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Fifty on August 26, 2011, 08:06:59 PM
Hello derajjared,

There are currently no open spaces in this netgame, please sign up for a space in the next game.

A link to the pak needed is in the first post of this topic. Use the stable 110.1 executable.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 27, 2011, 02:38:45 PM
The game just crashed again :(
Edit: I've got a savegame from ten minutes ago saved on my computer
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on August 27, 2011, 02:42:31 PM
I have savegame 5-10 minutes before crash, in case the save file corrupted again.
I got "segmentation fault" message in terminal before simutrans crashed.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 27, 2011, 04:49:08 PM
It does crash every so often, I've restarted it. I'll work on an auto-restart function...
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on August 28, 2011, 01:48:47 PM
Yes, you must be running out of things to work on!

I'm getting no response from the server at present.

On the savegame issue, I guess it's up to you how much drive space you want to devote to archiving however many saves, but my thinking is that we should only need to keep the second-to-last save, since if we're able to play to the last save, the second-last one must have worked OK.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on August 28, 2011, 01:52:31 PM
I was connected to the server two minutes ago, closed simutrans for a minute and tried to log in again - doesn't work now :(
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on August 28, 2011, 09:53:17 PM
Restarted it, the longer a game goes on the more frequent crashes seem to become.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on September 04, 2011, 04:29:25 AM
Our South freight player (SNCFS & Freight, in green) will have to leave the game on Thursday September 8 and we need to replace him. Interested players, please look at the network and see if you think you can run it. Other players on the map depend on traffic through this network so you must be able to manage it. Note that the trains run on the left-hand side. You will be able to change the name of the player but not the colour.

Another option is for the East pax player (Mobilet, in purple, it's me) to switch to South freight if someone would like to take over East passengers and mail. This network is stable, you can either maintain it with minimum effort, or expand it.

In both cases other players in the game can help you learn about the networks.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: rainer on September 04, 2011, 04:37:54 PM
Sorry, folks. From time to time I tried again to join and play, but the problems were even harder at the growing game.
I managed to keep my bus network stable and avoided overcrowding almost all of the time. That's all.

I just had a glance again and managed to add a bus to a line - in 30 minutes. : - (
Communication at ingame chat is impossible for me, communication here is too slow, and nobody uses #simutrans at irc.quakenet.org instead.
Communication by signs in the map is... hm... "strange".

Feel free to make my stops public wherever you want and connect to your networks. I do not know whether my network scales properly, but the admins might feel free to take every action which is needed.

I wish you a lot of fun with this game and the following, but I prefer not to join again.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: jjatca on September 04, 2011, 05:33:11 PM
 I would like to join as  the south freight player
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on September 05, 2011, 06:23:05 AM
Ok, so until thursday, you'll have to understand my network, I'll PM you my password, and then you'll be able to control it and to understand it.
You can ask your questions to me until thursday, but also to moblet, fifty (RFP in the game).
I don't know if you're used to left-handed network  ;)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yorkeiser on September 05, 2011, 08:13:39 AM
Hi,
I answer here to moblet's invitation because I've no pm's enabled (I never asked for it  ;D); I hope there's no problem doing that.
Yes, I like to build massive pax networks, and I like to actively participate in the online community: it saddens me to see it growing slowly, while games I really consider worse than Simutrans (aka TTD) have huge online communities.
I'll kindly join your server, if invited: in that case, I ask for a pax account, it's the same if it's on the east or the west of the map.

Cheers

Well now you asked for it...! Also, I wasn't sure if you could read what moblet sent. -- VS
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on September 05, 2011, 09:07:17 AM
rainer, thanks for responding. Sorry you are still having lag problems, we hope you can resolve them and join us in future. I will also have a look at quakenet, I haven't seen it yet.

yorkeiser, I have reset the password for Player 7 (W pax) and sent it to you by PM.

Guillaume and jjatca, it sounds like you have the handover under control. Contact me or post here if you are having any problems.

A reminder that Fifty (RF&P, dark blue, E freight) and I (Mobilet, purple, E pax) are the players who can act as the public player should you need electricity or want any public infratructure moved or created. Guillaume can also do this but only for the next few days.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on September 05, 2011, 07:40:19 PM
Welcome to the new players!

... Doesn't connect to the game now :(
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Xelofino on September 05, 2011, 08:22:16 PM
Hey all

I'm really sorry, that i wasn't on for 2-3 days now. I habe the game still in mind and with the money gaining i will be able to build amd destroy without getting instantly bankrupt. So i'ill join soon and slowly (which means really slowly) try to work on a connection of E and W. Who knows perhaps one day passengers can take the northern route :).

Xelofino
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yorkeiser on September 05, 2011, 08:45:54 PM
Server is down.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on September 05, 2011, 09:32:23 PM
Restarted it.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: jjatca on September 08, 2011, 03:02:10 AM
Thanks for letting me join. I will be on at about 7 to 8 Pacific Standard time
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Guillaume on September 08, 2011, 11:24:27 AM
So good luck  ;)     For me, in 3 hours holidays are finished  ::'(

I would like to thank moblet and Fifty for doing a very good server ( good rules, good maps,... ), hope you'll keep the server on in the future, and improving it.
I hope to see you in may 2012 to play with you on the server.
I played on this server with pleasure, online games are surely a great feature :award:
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on September 10, 2011, 08:25:00 AM
You might also want to try increasing the value of the "additional_client_frames_behind" setting in simuconf.tab, as this can help with latency issues on the client side. I already have the server equivalent set higher than the default.
Finally got my linux installation up, just wanted to report that at the default value of zero I had button lag of up to a minute or more. I changed it to 8 and lag is close to zero.

Machine spec is AMD Phenom II X2 550 with 4Gb RAM and nVidia GTS250 running Ubuntu 64-bit.

EDIT: Spoke too soon. Building controls are fine but depot controls have insane lag.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on September 10, 2011, 04:59:03 PM
Down again :(
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yoshi on September 14, 2011, 12:35:42 PM
Is the server down?
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on September 14, 2011, 12:59:45 PM
It should be back up now.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yoshi on September 17, 2011, 10:06:15 AM
I cannot play the game untill 26th Sep, as I will need to stay in Duesseldorf during the next week.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on September 19, 2011, 01:36:45 PM
Due to several problem (internet connection problem (it takes long time to download), computer problem (my faster computer can't boot, playing with my old computer causes heavy lag because the map has become too complex), ...), I can no longer actively play with the current game. :(

See you again in the next game. :)

However i'm still monitoring the chat, so if you need me, you can use the in game chat. I'll try to join if I can.
If you want to manage my company, you can, just ask me.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Fifty on September 20, 2011, 01:45:41 AM
Sorry to hear that you are unable to play anymore, Vonjo. I will take over your company for at least a little while. No need to send me the password, I can reset with public. See you next game.

Xelofino, do you still have time to play? Just wondering because I haven't seen you.

50.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on October 07, 2011, 01:39:57 AM
Just checking who is still active in this game and whether players who are no longer active want to leave, or to start on a fresh map. I am happy to continue on this map or start a new one.

All players please confirm that you are still playing, and vote on whether to continue this map or start a new one.

If the server list still hasn't been repopulated, the game's address is moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk:13357
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yorkeiser on October 07, 2011, 09:47:32 AM
I've been away for a bit, due to work engagement.
However, still happy to continue with this map, but no problem if other players want to restart with a new one
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: choro on October 07, 2011, 12:15:08 PM
I'd be happy to start a new game. I could improve my network in some cities, but that's less interesting than building an intercity network - which I have finished.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: yoshi on October 07, 2011, 01:20:02 PM
There is little chance to make a new route any more. I'd prefer a new game.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Vonjo on October 07, 2011, 02:07:31 PM
Currently I can't play because the map is too heavy.
I'd prefer a new game, so I can play again. :)
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Fifty on October 07, 2011, 08:43:30 PM
Hello, I'm very busy IRL at the moment and have for the most part stopped playing this map. I have also been building a massive network on the 64.entropy server (about 150 million in profit per month, freight only!), so I really don't have any time to play both maps. As much as I enjoy this server, I just don't think it has been all that popular.

I'm interested to test some of the new features in the nightlies too, and I think when Timothy gets some time he will compile a nightly for use on some of his servers.

I might be back later, but for the moment, count me out. Moblet, I will still be around if you want some assistance with maps, planning, ect; just PM me.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: jjatca on October 11, 2011, 01:25:18 AM
Currently, I can't play on the map easily  due to heavy development (creates lag), so i vote for a restart.
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: moblet on October 12, 2011, 11:39:58 AM
Game 3 will be uploaded to the server as soon as Timothy is able. Interested players please go to the join game 3 thread (http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=8216.0) to confirm your choices.

Fifty, thanks muchly for your contribution to developing the map and rules. See you in a game somewhere soon!
Title: Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
Post by: Ashley on October 12, 2011, 11:21:00 PM
New map has been uploaded, please let me know if you have any problems with it.