The International Simutrans Forum


Recent Posts

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 ... 10
Pak128.Britain-Ex / Re: Recalibration of town buildings
« Last post by wlindley on Today at 04:00:36 AM »
It sure would be nice if farms (anything with Fields), as they are built, would build a road of the lowest current capacity (e.g., bridleways in 1820) at least to their boundary (or, dare one hope, perhaps as far as the nearest road) to make it possible to connect farms to our player stations without having to spend 10 x 5000ยข bulldozing fields (or resorting to switching to the public player).
What about the two labels on the chart? I am putting temporary things now. - "mail_delivered" and "mail_no_route"
Simutrans Extended Development / Re: Overcrowding indication
« Last post by Vladki on Today at 12:49:34 AM »
Perhaps showing overcrowding only for passengers (and maybe mail)?
100% load is usually done only for freight.
Pak128.Britain-Ex / Re: 1870-1890's carriages lack class definitions
« Last post by jamespetts on Today at 12:02:48 AM »
There are some complex issues that have been raised. Firstly, length: it is generally preferable for all carriage graphics to have as accurate a length as possible. The lack of granularity in the length parameter is unfortunate, but all sorts of visual chaos will ensue if we start having carriages of deliberately the wrong length to work around this. Far better would be to work on allowing fractional lengths in the code (although this may be some way off unless someone else codes it).

Secondly, luggage: any representation of luggage in comfort must take account of the fact that the luggage carrying capacity of one vehicle in a train can affect the comfort of other vehicles. Doing this would require a change in the code (catering values are unsuitable, as they generate revenue as well as increasing comfort). For this reason, the simulation of luggage cars has generally been omitted, and, if included in some cases, would require revision of the entire pakset to add luggage vehicles to match all of the various railway carriages, which would be a very large task.

As for overcrowding, the policy so far has been to allow overcrowding in all but first class carriages/compartments. The general rule of thumb is, for non-corridor compartment stock, the overcrowded capacity is half as much again as the seated capacity, as generally as many people can stand in the middle of a compartment as can sit on either side of it. The same holds in corridor compartments, but people can also stand in the corridor, giving a higher ratio of overcrowded to seated capacity, and the same in saloon carriages.

Although people may prefer to stand in the corridor given the chance, people would undoubtedly have stood in compartments in corridor carriages if there were no other space available: it is not plausible that people would have refused to get on the train at all just because they have to stand in a compartment rather than in the corridor. People will stand anywhere with enough space if the train is crowded enough.

Edit: I have now had a chance to look over the code. I see that you have re-rendered quite a lot of vehicles: that is very helpful: thank you for that. I do take the point about the front/rear full brakes, as the graphics do show them having a particular end.
However, one thing that I do notice is that you have in some places (e.g. the LBSCR-4Wheel-First-fitted) added first class without modifying the capacity or comfort. The carriage, although modelled on a first class carriage, had the capacity and comfort that it would have had had it been built as a long-distance third class carriage: before classes were introduced, in the LBSCR carriages, class was used as a proxy for whether the carriages were long distance or suburban.

You will thus need to recalibrate the comfort and capacity of these carriages to match with them being first class (i.e. three a side in each compartment and with a comfort matching contemporaneous first class vehicles). For reference, this is what an LBSCR 4 wheel first class compartment looks like:
LBSCR 4 wheel first (interior) by James Petts, on Flickr
LBSCR 4 wheel first (interior) by James Petts, on Flickr
Pak128.Britain-Ex / Re: Tracks and signalling
« Last post by jamespetts on Yesterday at 11:53:40 PM »
Thank you for your feedback.

It is not clear what advantage that there would be to a player in setting a speed limit on a piece of railway line: a player always has an incentive to allow trains to travel as fast as possible. In reality, people who run railways set speed limits because, without them, the trains might crash because they cannot stop for signals in time, derail on corners or at least the passengers might be thrown around inside the trains travelling too fast around corners; however, we do not simulate any of those things in Simutrans, so the speed limits need to be imposed automatically to simulate what sensible people running a railway would do in reality to ensure safe operation.

The imposition of speed limits by players is a different topic to the issue of differential speed limits which I believe is where this topic began. Differential speed limits, as I understand it, are used where different types of rolling stock have different characteristics which allow them to travel safely at a higher speed over certain stretches of line, such as the ability of tilting trains to take corners more quickly or the ability of trains with better brakes to stop in time for signals spaced more closely together.

In Simutrans-Extended these attributes are simulated, not by a fixed speed limit imposed on a section of track, but by a dynamically calculated speed limit for corners and dynamically calculated braking distances for signals. This gives the closest conformity to the modelling of the economic effect of various features of railway operation (such as signal spacing, curve radii, tilting mechanisms, braking capabilities and so forth) with the minimum of complexity both to code and to interact with for the player. The thing to remember is that the speed limit for a particular type of track is not intended to be a representation of the line speed limit of an actual piece of railway line: it is intended only to be a representation of the fastest line speed limit that that type of track will allow. The actual line speeds are calculated dynamically taking into account all relevant features.

Remember, the goal of Simutrans-Extended is to be an economic simulation, not a computerised model railway. Operational details that have minimal economic impact and which would be complicated to simulate (e.g. the fact that, in reality, speed limits are calculated by engineers when the line is constructed rather than calculated dynamically by each passing train) are generally not represented.
Thank you Ranran for your very diligent work on this and to everyone else for the very helpful and precise feedback. If I may add some feedback of my own at this juncture:

(1) "no mail service" and "no passenger service" is probably clearer than "mail service is not provided" and "passenger service is not provided", but these should only show if there are no mail or passenger transporting lines/convoys (respectively) registered to call at the stop in question;
(2) the percentages versus actual numbers issue is a complex one; I wonder whether a solution would be to have one or other of the values (i.e. the percentage or the absolute numbers) as part of the tooltip (in which case, I should be grateful for people's views as to which would be better);
(3) I think that the snail icon is clear, but there is a limit to what can be achieved with low pixel counts;
(4) I like the new mail success and failure icons; and
(5) a green face would not be a good idea as the person would look ill; perhaps a green tick or similar would be better (if green be used, the graph colours should be co-ordinated).

Thank you very much for your work on this: this is most helpful.
Thank you for the report. Are you able to upload a saved game in which this issue can be reproduced?
Pak128.Britain-Ex / Re: Recalibration of town buildings
« Last post by jamespetts on Yesterday at 11:16:12 PM »
Thank you for your feedback: this is most helpful. In general, having a large number of farms is correct: most of the English countryside is taken up with agricultural usage. The issue with small farms is likely to be very complex to solve, as it would require new and possibly very complex algorithms to work out how many fields that a farm would be able to generate in the future (since the generation of the fields is after the generation of the farms themselves).

I have not looked in any detail at the manual industry creation tool. You write that such industries are usually out of staff: have you checked whether the staff demand is different from automatically generated industries?
Simutrans Extended Development / Re: Overcrowding indication
« Last post by jamespetts on Yesterday at 11:08:27 PM »
I think having overcrowded as an indication that the convoy is at least full (not including overcrowded capacity) is probably pretty good, as long as this indication is disabled if the convoy is set to wait for 100% loading at any point in its schedule (in which case it is deliberately being run at full or over-capacity).

This latter exception concerns me a little: I imagine this being very confusing for players to understand, as it is very subtle. I wonder whether there is a way to avoid these problems while addressing the issue that this exception was intended to address?
Simutrans Extended Development / Re: Overcrowding indication
« Last post by ACarlotti on Yesterday at 09:47:51 PM »
I think having overcrowded as an indication that the convoy is at least full (not including overcrowded capacity) is probably pretty good, as long as this indication is disabled if the convoy is set to wait for 100% loading at any point in its schedule (in which case it is deliberately being run at full or over-capacity).
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 ... 10