Author Topic: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial  (Read 11165 times)

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Offline HaydenRead

Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« on: January 12, 2016, 09:31:27 AM »
Hi Everyone,
I am currently working on a Scenario Tutorial for Simutrans using Pak128.

The Scenario will require the '<img > tag patch' applied to v 120.1.2 or above of Simutrans. (It will work without the <img > tag patch, however will not display properly as <img > tags will be interpreted as < i > tags, and images will not be displayed).

This is intended to be included with the Steam version of Simutrans when it is released to Steam.

The Scenario will be split into a number of chapters with the currently intended chapters being:
  • Getting Started
  • Ruling the Roads
  • Riding the Rails
  • Setting Sail
  • Taking to the Air
  • Advanced Topics

I have currently coded 'Getting Started', and most of 'Ruling the Roads'.

My reasoning for starting with Roads, as opposed to Rails is that Roads already exist in towns, so bus stops etc can be built without needing to worry about track laying, etc. Also, most Roads can be placed on "Double Height" hills.

Once it is complete, I would appreciate assistance translating it.

I will post versions as I progress, with the first version being posted once I have finished the Road section, to try and get feed back on how to improve the Tutorial Scenario.

I have attached 2 files:
  • ST120.1.2.zip (1.7mb) is the Windows Binary files (.exe / .dll files) required to run the Tutorial
  • Tutorial128.zip (173 kb) is the Tutorial so far (Road section almost complete)
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 03:50:38 AM by HaydenRead »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2016, 08:38:31 PM »
I'm okay to test your scenario, eventually include it directly in pak128 (if you are okay with that). A tutorial is precisely what Simutrans has needed for so long and using a scenario for this was discussed many times. It's great that someone has some time and motivation to make it, so you already deserve a big THANK YOU.

Oh and of course I'm okay to translate it to French once it's finished  ;)

Offline ny911

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2016, 11:34:48 PM »
Great!

It can also be published at the scenario page. At the german forum you can find a thread for a pak64 Scenario Tutorial
http://www.simutrans-forum.de/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=7685&pageNo=1
So feel free to use the scenario source.  It is still in process, but it is pak set free coded. Usable for chapters and more.

Here is the latest untested code (pak64, german):
http://www.simutrans-forum.de/forum/index.php?page=Thread&postID=104791#post104791

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2016, 07:43:54 PM »
Hello such!!

It seems that something broke in the version released on Steam  I can not advance from chapter one and no images are displayed ... (at least on linux).

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2016, 02:25:12 PM »

@HaydenRead
I've been changing a bit the tutorial scenario to make it much easier to follow, also I have the intention to add some chapters to make it look more beautiful.


Scenario: Tutorial-test3.zip (Test with last night.)


Regards!.

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2016, 09:04:18 PM »
I've made some adjustments to the English translations.

As soon as some chapters are 100% done, I'll start translating them to Dutch (my mother-tongue) and French (second language in Belgium).
I might have a go on German as well. (unless someone wants to do them and speaks better German than I of course :p )

I had just one problem.
I couldn't understand what you (or the other translator) mean with this (chapter2, step1):
The first thing to do, is to check whether the place where the depot is placed, there is a stretch of road.



In the attachment:
-a zip-file containing all files for the scenario.
Tutorial-test3 (English Corrections).zip

Offline Frank

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2016, 08:34:26 AM »
for translating added to Translator

Set: Scenario Tutorial pak128

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2016, 08:40:21 AM »

@Tjoker
Can you upload the files to mediafire ?, I have problems with Dropbox.

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2016, 09:18:03 AM »

Offline Frank

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2016, 09:29:50 AM »
@Tjoker
Can you upload the files to mediafire ?, I have problems with Dropbox.

upload to files.simutrans-germany.com, i think not problems for all

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2016, 05:23:46 PM »

I have given the finishing touches at second chapter, it works great now, thanks to Dwachs. :thumbsup:

Scenario: Tutorial-test4.zip

Please check these translations:


Code: [Select]
Form here


Por aqui


[1/6] First you must build one or more bus stops in %s city.


[1/6] Primero debes colocar una o mas paradas de autobus en Ciudad %s.


[2/6] Using the Roads Tool connect the two points between %s and %s.


[2/6] Use la Herramienta de Carreteras para conectar los puntos entre %s y %s.
[3/6] Use the Deposit Road %s to buy a new bus.
[3/6] Use el Deposito de Caretera %s para comprar un nuevo autobus.


[4/6] Click on Schedule and select one or more stops in %s city.


[4/6] Click en Enrutar y seleccione una o mas paradas en Ciudad %s city.


[5/6] Now select one or more stops in %s city.


[5/6] Ahora seleccione una o mas paradas en Ciudad %s.


[6/6] Select the last stop (%s) and place the Load (Min) at 100%%.


[6/6] Seleccione la ultima parada (%s) y coloque la Carga (Min) en 100%%.


Action not allowed


Accion no permitida


You must first build a stretch of road


Primero debe construir un tramo de carretera


You must build the depot in


Debe construir el deposito en


You must leave this free road for the second bus.


Debes dejar este camino libre para el segundo autobus.


First you must build the 4 stops.


Primero debe construir las 4 paradas.


Stops should be built on a road.


Las paradas deben construirse sobre una carretera.


It is very close to the other stop


Demasiado cerca de la otra parada


Stops should be built in Cantebury City


Las paradas deben construirse en Ciudad Cantebury


You must click on the stops


Debe hacer click sobre las paradas


Only 4 stops are necessary.


Solo son necesarias 4 paradas.


Choose a different stop.


Elija una parada diferente.


The route is complete, you must now start the vehicle from the depot


La ruta esta completa, ahora debe arrancar el vehiculo desde la cochera


You must first select the stops in Cantebury City


Primero debes seleccionar las paradas en Cantebury


First you must connect the two cities.


Primero debe conectar las dos ciudades.


Connect the road here


Conecte la carretera por aqui


The first vehicle has a minimum load of 100% at this stop, this restricts the passage of other vehicles.


El primer vehiculo tiene una carga minima de 100% en esta parada, esto restringe el paso de otros vehiculos.


You must first build a stop in Lancaster City


Primero debe construir una parada en Lancaster


Stops should be built in Lancaster City


Las paradas deben construirse en Ciudad Lancaster

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2016, 09:53:44 PM »
These are only the corrected sentences.
I'm not a native speaker so somebody might have to recheck this.  :)

[1/6] First you must build one or more bus stops in %s.
I'd drop "city".

[2/6] Use the Road Tool to connect the two points between %s and %s.

[3/6] Use the Depot %s to buy a new bus.
To what does the %s refer here?

[4/6] Click on Schedule and select one or more stops in %s city.
I assume this should be:
Click on <no schedule set> and select <create new line>.
Then select one or more stops in %s.

[5/6] Now select one or more stops in %s.


You must leave this road clear for the second bus.

You must build the 4 stops first.

The route is complete, now you may start the vehicle from the depot.

You must select the stops in Cantebury first


You must connect the two cities first.

You must build a stop in Lancaster first


Stops should be built in Lancaster

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2016, 10:27:13 PM »

These are only the corrected sentences.
I'm not a native speaker so somebody might have to recheck this.  :)


[1/6] First you must build one or more bus stops in %s. %s="City Name"
I'd drop "city".

[2/6] Use the Road Tool to connect the two points between %s and %s. %s="Coordinates point"

[3/6] Use the Depot %s to buy a new bus. %s="Coordinates of deposit."
To what does the %s refer here?

[4/6] Click on Schedule and select one or more stops in %s city. %s="City Name"
I assume this should be:
Click on <no schedule set> and select <create new line>.
Then select one or more stops in %s. %s="City Name"

[5/6] Now select one or more stops in %s. %s="City Name"

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2016, 10:34:43 PM »
ok, than the %s can stay, I thought it referred to the city.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2016, 10:19:45 PM »

@TjoekerThese are the texts of chapter 3 in Spanish.

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2016, 03:56:17 PM »
I don't speak Spanish, could you try to translate it to English?
It doesn't matter if it's a bad translation, I'll correct it. ;)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #16 on: October 17, 2016, 05:38:50 AM »

It was difficult, but finally achieve complete chapter 3.


Tutorial-ch3.zip


Still pending translations into English because I do not have internet on my computer and I depend on google translator. :-[

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2016, 05:59:23 AM »
hmm, I see. I can have a look tomorrow.
Or is there anyone who speaks both Spanish and English, and is willing to help translating?

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2016, 02:07:59 AM »

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2016, 08:24:24 PM »
@Tjoeker


I added the corrections, please check that all is well (may I make mistakes). :P


I also take the opportunity to correct some errors. ;D


http://www.mediafire.com/file/2xb9z0ey7zuik5x/Tutorial-0.2-traduc.zip

Offline Vladki

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2016, 11:15:43 AM »
Hi, I'm trying the tutorial scenario (and intent to translate it to Czech).

I noticed that tin chapter 2, step C, I cannot build a bus stop at (98,97) - getting message: "you must leave this road clear for second bus". What is that?

I had a bit of problem to get through the CH2, step D - setting up the schedule. I got no feedback after setting the load to 100%. It did not let me continue If I set "copy backwards" - so a hint to make circular route would be nice.

CH3, paso B, step 1 - build straight slope - well there is already a straight slope - there should be some explanation about double heights and the need to have full height slope at the tunnel entrance. Flat slope is IMHO nonsense - either flat tile, or half slope. The necessary slope could be built by "classic" up/down tool.

Also the player could be allowed to make a cutting for the bus line in ch.2. Just to show him how it can speed up the travel.

CH3 paso D, step 1 - build tram rails? Should be train rails? And then the same with electric trains..

Ch3 - building the mail line - would be nice to let players build bridges over rivers, if they want. Also hints about recommended type of road/rail/catenary/tunnel/bridge would be nice.

Ch3 Paso I, step 6 - building signals - should tell the player how to make them single faced (one-way)

Ch3 paso I, even though I built quite a small train  (flying berliner) - it took ages to fill it to 100% as was required by script. (Maybe because I built the bus stop next to train station, so it took away many passengers). I was not wiling to wait and let the train depart without filling, but the scenario did not advance further. If there are no more tasks, it should say something.

I think setting 100% load for passenger service is not a good idea - it is enough to show it at freight services. Perhaps it should also lead the player to make stop at rio de abajo on the way back.


Anyway, good job ;) looking forward for further chapters.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #21 on: October 23, 2016, 02:05:56 PM »



Quote
I noticed that tin chapter 2, step C, I cannot build a bus stop at (98,97) - getting message: "you must leave this road clear for second bus". What is that?
Simply hinders the passage of the second bus.


Quote
I had a bit of problem to get through the CH2, step D - setting up the schedule. I got no feedback after setting the load to 100%. It did not let me continue If I set "copy backwards" - so a hint to make circular route would be nice.
Do not use "copy backwards".


Quote
I think setting 100% load for passenger service is not a good idea - it is enough to show it at freight services. Perhaps it should also lead the player to make stop at rio de abajo on the way back.
This is easy to change. ;)



My idea is to use images to better explain things, but I'm still waiting for the patch: http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=15049.0


You can send the text files modified? (I'm not very good with English).


Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2016, 03:50:44 PM »
I'll adjust the textfiles (where possible without having to alter the code).

Players probably won't use 'copy backwards' as they are not told to do so.
But, This gave me an idea.
Why not let them make a second line, where they should use copy backwards?

Offline Vladki

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #23 on: October 23, 2016, 05:26:47 PM »
I'll adjust the textfiles (where possible without having to alter the code).

Players probably won't use 'copy backwards' as they are not told to do so.
But, This gave me an idea.
Why not let them make a second line, where they should use copy backwards?

What about putting some curiosity (castle) half-way between the cities, and telling the player to make the first line (inside the city) circular, and the second line (inter-city) stop at the curiosity and use "copy backwards"

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #24 on: October 23, 2016, 08:06:31 PM »
Good idea, Yona-TYT, what do you think?

I need a little help from a native English speaker.
How would you say this?:

"In this tutorial, the first steps in setting up your transportation empire in Simutrans are explained. The focus is on the necessary actions around transportation chains in Simutrans."


I am currently playing the scenario to see if I made any weird mistakes in its context.
But I still have this error at the end of chapter 1, step 3.
As soon as I click on the city hall, I get this error: (a hundred of them)

« Last Edit: October 23, 2016, 08:19:55 PM by Tjoeker »

Offline jameskuyper

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2016, 08:21:35 PM »
...
I need a little help from a native English speaker.
How would you say this?:

"In this tutorial, the first steps in setting up your transportation empire in Simutrans are explained. The focus is on the necessary actions around transportation chains in Simutrans."

Only the second sentence needs changing. Depending upon what you meant, this might be right:

The focus is on the actions necessary to build transportation chains in Simutrans.

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #26 on: October 23, 2016, 08:23:37 PM »
I feel like the first sentence needs some changing as well.
It might grammatically be correct, it uses to many "in"s, which makes it difficult to read.

thanks for your help ;)

I found another bug in the scenario.
Chapter 1, step 1.
Sometimes I don't even get to see this step?
But besides that, the text asks me to rotate the map to continue to the next step.
But as soon as I move around and zoom in and out, the scenario proceeds to the next step...
Might not be a big deal, but can I change the text then? Or can you change the code? :)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #27 on: October 23, 2016, 09:37:19 PM »
Good idea, Yona-TYT, what do you think?

I need a little help from a native English speaker.
How would you say this?:

"In this tutorial, the first steps in setting up your transportation empire in Simutrans are explained. The focus is on the necessary actions around transportation chains in Simutrans."


I am currently playing the scenario to see if I made any weird mistakes in its context.
But I still have this error at the end of chapter 1, step 3.
As soon as I click on the city hall, I get this error: (a hundred of them)


You can send a saved game ?.


Edit.

Create a new installation of simutrans using r7919 or r7920.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2016, 09:54:02 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #28 on: October 24, 2016, 08:32:13 AM »
I already have nightly r7920
I can't save the game if the error already occured.
But here is the save game just the step before the error:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/u1o74x1eyu62o6t/Tutorial_Error.sve

hmm, obviously you can't save a scenario, as you can open the map, but not the scenario...

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #29 on: October 24, 2016, 01:40:48 PM »
« Last Edit: October 24, 2016, 02:20:13 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline Dwachs

  • DevTeam, Coder/patcher
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Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #30 on: October 24, 2016, 06:27:52 PM »
@Tjoeker: Please update the game files (not only the executable) to a recent nightly.
Parsley, sage, rosemary, and maggikraut.

Offline HarrierST

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #31 on: October 25, 2016, 02:18:33 AM »

I need a little help from a native English speaker.
How would you say this?:

"In this tutorial, the first steps in setting up your transportation empire in Simutrans are explained. "

Try:

"In this tutorial, the first steps when setting up your transportation empire in Simutrans are explained. "

Offline Tjoeker

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #32 on: October 25, 2016, 06:15:12 PM »
...

I think setting 100% load for passenger service is not a good idea - it is enough to show it at freight services. Perhaps it should also lead the player to make stop at rio de abajo on the way back.

...

Maybe we can spawn some people at the first stop after a small amount of time?


Yona-TYT,

Do you mind if I sometimes add some text to make some things clearer?
Like a little explanation here and there.
It's up to you to translate these back to Spanish ;)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #33 on: October 25, 2016, 07:04:35 PM »
Yona-TYT,

Do you mind if I sometimes add some text to make some things clearer?
Like a little explanation here and there.
It's up to you to translate these back to Spanish ;)
There is no problem. ;) The truth is I'm not very good at explaining things. :P

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #34 on: January 02, 2017, 03:28:03 AM »
I've fixed some bugs and applied this http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=16523.msg157450#msg157450 to make things a bit more straightforward.

Scenario: Tutorial-stable.zip

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #35 on: January 04, 2017, 08:09:03 PM »
I get an error when loading your scenario ("new handler", "OUT OF MEMORY" sort of thing). Sound familiar or do I report a bug ?

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #36 on: January 05, 2017, 07:10:07 PM »
I get an error when loading your scenario ("new handler", "OUT OF MEMORY" sort of thing). Sound familiar or do I report a bug ?

Hi, how are you? Thank you for trying the scenario. ;)

It seems that savegame is not compatible with your version of simutrans, you should use one night.



A small update.
Scenario:
Tutorial-v2.0.5.zip[/color]

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2017, 06:10:35 PM »
I'm fine, thanks ;) got very busy last year, no time or energy to make pak128 progress unfortunately. I Hope this year will be better.

Now I get a message "Loading scenario script failed" :/ (using Tutorial-v2.0.5, pak128 2.6, Simutrans 120.1.4 nightly rr8016 for linux)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #38 on: January 12, 2017, 09:28:37 PM »
I'm fine, thanks ;) got very busy last year, no time or energy to make pak128 progress unfortunately. I Hope this year will be better.

Now I get a message "Loading scenario script failed" :/ (using Tutorial-v2.0.5, pak128 2.6, Simutrans 120.1.4 nightly rr8016 for linux)
You should do a complete update, (all files) ... it's the only thing I can think of because here the script works well.

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #39 on: January 14, 2017, 09:55:02 PM »
That's what I did when I tried the nightly build :( I will retry later with a completely fresh install.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #40 on: March 31, 2017, 04:13:18 AM »
After much work, here is a new version (only for testing).

Note: Use r8160 or higher

Scenario:
Tutorial-v3.0.0-beta.zip (Some translations are still missing.)
Changes:
- Stops/stations can now be deleted.
- The roads are now marked.
- The roads are no longer straight, it is free to choose where to build the road / rails.
- I've rewritten most of Chapter 3 (now it's more fun).
- The limits for the use of tools are marked (text labels are used).
- I have removed the part of electrified trains (soon will return).





@Gauthier, I hope this works for you.... greetings!!.  ;)
« Last Edit: March 31, 2017, 02:24:26 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #41 on: April 02, 2017, 06:52:28 AM »
Quote
@Gauthier, I hope this works for you.... greetings!!.  ;)
Looks like it works \o/ I'm going to give this a try  ;)

EDIT:

Here are all my comments. Sorry, it's long and mostly bothering you with text interpretation or typos :p



Typo in Scenario Info: "Chapterseach"

Took me some minutes to figure out that being in pause mode prevents scenario from going to the next step -_-" That should not happen with beginners of course, until one of them incidentally hit "p" :/

When you write things like "pressing the "A" key", this can be mistaken with shift + A, especially after explaining that map rotating needs shift + R.

That should be a bug unexpected feature report: coordinates change when rotating the map (that's already a major consistency problem in itself ! coordinates should be absolute, GPS coordinates of a point on Earth does not depend of the angle under which you are looking at the map.), and are not updated in the scenario description as long as the game is in pause (yes, I'm almost always in pause :p ).

"Cantebury has requested you to" can mistake some players into thinking that there is some kind of requests to fullfil in the game, that is not.

"First, you need to check whether there is a dead-end road underneath the depot." implies that a depot already exists and that one has to check if everything is ok under the depot. Not very clear ... I suggest "First, you need a depot to buy buses, [construction instructions]."

Why not giving coordinates to build the four bus stops in Chaper 2.C ? Showing players that these stops need to be built at reasonable distance from each other.

Images in scenario would be great to show what bus the player is expected to buy :p

Chapter 2.D: after having clicked the left arrow, the player has no instruction of closing the schedule window and starting the bus. Such instructions obviously sounds useless to us as people playing for long years, however there are still necessary for beginners who are afraid of doing anything wrong.

Chapter 2.E: "1You ..." -> "1. You ..."

Chapter 2.E: In the description of the first way of building a bridge, placing roads at extremities is no longer necessary for a few Simutrans releases now.

Chapter 2.F [2/6]: asks me to connect the two points between ... (97,7) and (97,7) even if the red marks are good. Finer instructions about building roads should be given here ("click here", "click there")

Chapter 3.A: "Grnaja de trigo" is named "Grain Farm" for me, idem for the mill.

Chapter 3.B [1/5]: "Connect the two points ..." Yes, but how ? Finest instructions should be given "select the ** km/h rail tool", the tutorial should show the player that the choice of the rail is not random, "click here", "click there".

Chapter 3.B [2/5]: I'm a beginner, never used terraforming tools, have no idea of what is a "straight slope". Finest instructions like "select the raise land tool", "click here", "click there" would be more appropriate ... oh it looks like I'm wrong, artificial slopes are expected here :p well, that does not matter, fine instructions are needed here.

Chapter 3.B. [4/5]: Fine instructions needed, I'm a beginner and I never built a tunnel.

Chapter 3.C [1/2]: idem, even if the moving mark is great !

Chapter 3.D [1/3]: "TRAM" rails ??? what the ... ?

Chapter 3.E [3]: I have a missing word "Select  and select the station ..." ... oh and the player has not been asked to open the convoy's schedule ;)

Chapter 3.G: typo in the mark at (38,2)

Chapter 3.G [1]: I'm asked to build TRAM (!) rails, at only one point instead of between two points as the marks on the map suggest.

Chapter 3.G: Looks like the game wants me to create the convoy, but I could not build rails and stations where it was necessary. Major bug here.

Could not go further :(




I learned some keyboard shortcuts thanks to your tutorial :p

This tutorial has great potential, I think more care should be given to details when explaining things to beginners. If you need help on the texts, I can help ;)
 

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #42 on: April 02, 2017, 12:15:03 PM »

This tutorial has great potential, I think more care should be given to details when explaining things to beginners. If you need help on the texts, I can help ;)
 

Yes, I need help with the texts.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #43 on: April 02, 2017, 05:41:02 PM »
Here again, this time there are few changes.

Tutorial-v3.0.01.zip  (test only)

Changes:
Rewriting the part for the placement of passing signals.
F [1/5] The use of tools is now blocked to avoid interfering with the route of the first train.
Changes in some texts.


Edit.
@Gauthier.
Quote
Why not giving coordinates to build the four bus stops in Chaper 2.C? Showing players that these stops need to be built at reasonable distance from each other.
I like to let the player decide where to build, maybe I should put this to a vote.
Quote
Chapter 2.D: after having clicked the left arrow, the player has no instruction of closing the schedule window and starting the bus. Such instructions obviously sounds useless to us people for long years, however they are still necessary for beginners who are afraid of doing anything wrong.
The bus starts, there is no need to close the schedule window.

Quote
Chapter 3.G: typo in the mark at (38,2)
The mark is correct, just pass me through a tile with the limits (very easy to solve).

Quote
Chapter 3.G: Looks like the game wants to create the convoy, but I could not build rails and stations where it was necessary. Major bug here.
Can you send me a savegame?

The rest are text errors (I do not know much English). :-[
« Last Edit: April 02, 2017, 07:41:29 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #44 on: April 04, 2017, 06:51:00 PM »
Could you send me a private message with an email adress ? The savegame is a little bigger than the forum's attachement size limit.

How can I help with the texts ?

By the way ... Chapter 2.D: I have two useless "x" marks at 97,31 and 98,31. (in the previous version of the tutorial, not the one you just uploaded).

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #45 on: April 07, 2017, 03:08:43 AM »

Chapter 3.G: Looks like the game wants me to create the convoy, but I could not build rails and stations where it was necessary. Major bug here.

Could not go further :(
I do not understand how to advance level without first building the rails that connect the two factories (something very strange is happening).

I suspect that pausing the game is causing problems (I think Prissi mentioned something about this).

By the way ... Chapter 2.D: I have two useless "x" marks at 97,31 and 98,31. (in the previous version of the tutorial, not the one you just uploaded).
It is to avoid obstructing the passage to the second bus.

How can I help with the texts ?
These are the text files for the scenario information window:
en-text.zip

 

In good time! Here another version

Scenario: Tutorial-v3.2.0.0-beta.zip

Changes:
Re-written the part of chapter 2, now are indicated  the points where to place the stops.

Chapter 3, now advances level after the factories receive goods.

Added the following texts:
Quote
__Step 3__
It is necessary to build bus stops at each of the points marked in the city
Note: The stops have a coverage of 4x4, therefore it is advisable to place the stops at a distance of 4 tiles (squares).

__Step 4__
To configure the route of the vehicle, you must first click on the "Schedule" button.
With the "Schedule" window open, you should now select all stops in the city to add them to the list.
After adding the 7 stops, select the first one from the list and place the Minimum load at 100%.

------------------------------------
__Pop-up window__
You can only build stops on roads
You can only build stops on flat ground
You can only build on a straight road
It is not possible to build stops at intersections
The "station name" stop must be for passengers
There is already a stop here.
Place the stops at the marked points.
You can only delete the stops.
Indicates the limits for using construction tools
The stop "station name" was not selected



@gauthier, Please try to replicate the error with the new version, greetings !.

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #46 on: April 08, 2017, 07:50:56 AM »
Hi !

Trying your latest release (3.2.0.0-beta):

Script crashed after placing two stops (A at 95,6 and B at 90,4) in Lancaster, buying a bus in the depot, setting the schedule to serve
_ one stop in Canteburry
_ stop A in Lancaster
_ stop B in Lancaster
_ stop A in Lancaster
-> boom

I started working on the texts and will progress as far as the crashes allow me to do :p

EDIT: Oh and I did not use pause at any moment from the loading of the scenario ;)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #47 on: April 08, 2017, 12:06:05 PM »
Hi !

Trying your latest release (3.2.0.0-beta):

Script crashed after placing two stops (A at 95,6 and B at 90,4) in Lancaster, buying a bus in the depot, setting the schedule to serve
_ one stop in Canteburry
_ stop A in Lancaster
_ stop B in Lancaster
_ stop A in Lancaster
-> boom

I started working on the texts and will progress as far as the crashes allow me to do :p

EDIT: Oh and I did not use pause at any moment from the loading of the scenario ;)

I have already fixed those errors, but I have not finished the next version.
I attached the file for chapter 2. (Needs the r8198 or higher).
Replace the one in "/ Tutorial / class"

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #48 on: April 09, 2017, 07:12:07 AM »
Now stuck at 3.A.2, clicked on Grnaja de Trigo but the scenario does not proceed.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #49 on: April 09, 2017, 12:19:03 PM »
Forget about that  lol.   :o

Solved here: class_chapter_03.nut

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #50 on: April 10, 2017, 12:01:11 PM »
The v3.5 is already ready! ;D

Edit.
Change to v3.5.01
Scenario: Tutorial-v3.5.01.zip (Needs the r8198 or higher).

Changes:
- [Chapter 2] Some errors are fixed.
- [Chapter 3 step 1] You can now advance level by clicking on the fields around the farm.
- [Chapter 3 step 10] Electrified train again.
- [Chapter 3] Some bug fixes.

Added the following texts:

Quote
Chapter 2
________________________________________________Step 4_______________________________________________________________ __________
>[1] First click on the  Garage{pos} and I bought a bus {busname}.


[2] To configure the route of the vehicle, you must first click on the Schedule button.


[3] With the Schedule window open, you should now select all stops in the city to add them to the list:

{posb}


[4] After adding the 7 stops, select the first one from the list and place the Minimum load at 100%.


[5] Now click the Start button so that the vehicle starts from the deposit.



It advances to the next step when the bus arrives at the first way stops on the list.



__Pop-up window__
The schedule needs to have 2 or more ways tops.

------------------------------------
Chapter 3
________________________________________________Step 1_______________________________________________________________ __________
Wheat farm
Wheat mill

________________________________________________Step 5 and 7_______________________________________________________________ __________
It advances to the next step when the {cmi} receive 162t of grains.

 
 
Received amount: <st>{reached}t</st>
________________________________________________Step 10______________________________________________________________ ___________
Use the Catenary tool to electrify all rails

__Pop-up window__
You must use the inspection tool
It is not allowed to build here
Station No.%d here
You can only delete the stations.
This rails is reserved for the first train
You must build the bridge here
You can only remove the bridge
Only delete signals
The signal does not point in the correct direction
Place a block signal here
It must be a block signal!
The signal is ready!

« Last Edit: April 11, 2017, 04:34:30 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #51 on: April 10, 2017, 06:05:38 PM »
Before I test it, have you made sure that the scenario is able to finish ? :p

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #52 on: April 10, 2017, 06:25:53 PM »
Before I test it, have you made sure that the scenario is able to finish ? :p
You should be able to get to Chapter 3 - Step J.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #53 on: April 11, 2017, 04:29:55 PM »
I release this version to correct an error with the texts.

I also removed the pause button to avoid problems and others that were not needed.

Tutorial-v3.5.01.zip

Before I test it, have you made sure that the scenario is able to finish ? :p
I apologize for so many problems, but they are a lot of things and it is difficult to try them all.

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #54 on: April 11, 2017, 06:30:36 PM »
Quote
I apologize for so many problems, but they are a lot of things and it is difficult to try them all.
I did not say that seriously, sorry if I was misunderstood  :-[

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #55 on: April 13, 2017, 05:03:23 PM »
Using v3.5.01

Warning: at loading the scenario, view is not on the main town, that can be unconfortable for new players.

3.F : Got a "Not allowed" message when building the third tile of the wheat mill's station, although a second attempt worked well.

3.G : "It advances to the next step when the Whear mill receive 154t of grains" -> it's about the bakery receiving flour now, no longer about the wheat mill receiving grains.

3.H.1 : The instruction lacks coordinates so the player doesn't know where to build the tunnel entrance.

After completing 3.J, I only have a "{tx10}". Is that the current end of the tutorial ?

I'm now working on fixing English texts and creating French ones :)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #56 on: April 13, 2017, 05:15:36 PM »
Quote
3.F: Got a "Not allowed" message when building the third tile of the wheat mill's station, although a second attempt worked well.
That happens when the tool gets stuck by accident, (I tried to improve this but no luck).

Quote
3.G: "It advances to the next step when the Whear mill receives grains" -> it's about the bakery receiving flour now, no longer about the wheat mill receiving grains.
It is already fixed.

Quote
3.H.1: The instruction lacks coordinates so the player does not know where to build the tunnel entrance.
It is already fixed.

Quote
After completing 3.J, I only have a "{tx10}". Is that the end of the tutorial?
For the moment yes.

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #57 on: April 15, 2017, 12:47:17 PM »
I reworked the texts in English (attached file), especially to give more precise instructions when the player has to build something (going in the toolbar, etc ...).

The distribution of text pieces between .tab files and language folders is not really clear to me, especially when it comes to building the tunnel between the grain farm and the mill (there's no mention of this in the files in the language folders, only in the en.tab).

In the en.tab file, in some couples, I modified the lower text as the upper one is used for matching with some hardcoded text (I suppose). Is it okay to have the hard coded text also modified so the en.tab becomes homogenous again ?

I will make a French translation as soon as all theses points are clear.

Here is a non-exhaustive changelog, only really relevant changes are here:
Quote
1.B : Added a warning about map coordinates changing with rotation.

2 : Changed the formulation "has requested you ..." by something more neutral that does not imply that there are precise objectives in the game.

2.A : Added a paragraph to tell the player to open the road toolbar, select the 50 km/h road, and how to build a road.

2.B : Modified the text as a consequence of the previous change.

2.C : Fixed the coverage area size (5x5 and not 4x4). Added a tip to see covered tiles with the "v" key. Mentioned that stops too are in the road tools toolbar. Added a note that streets don't need to be covered as they do not generate passengers.

2.D : Added instructions to eventually close the schedule window and to click on the start button.

2.E : Removed the instruction to place a road on the two opposing slopes, which is not necessary. Added instruction to pick up the 50 km/h bridge in the road tools toolbar.

3.A.2 : Added an example for the parts Production and Consumption. Mentioned that transporting workers to the factory is not mandatory though it increases production.

3.B : In the last paragraph, replaced the word "road" by "railroad".

3.B.1 : Added instructions to open the railroad tools toolbar and select a track.

3.B.2 : Added instructions to open the landscaping tools toolbar and select the appropriate slopes. Replaced "straight slope" with "steep slope".

3.B.4 : Added instructions to select a tunnel tool in the railroad tools toolbar and click on the steep slope.

3.C : Added the piece of information that station tools are also in the railroad tools toolbar.

3.D.1 : Replaced "tram rails" with "rails".

3.E.A : Added the piece of information that locomotives are in the "locomotives" tab, and wagons in the cars "tab". Fixed a missing word in [3]: when you want to actually print "<" or ">" in a XML-like code, you have to use "&lt" and "&gt". Tip: added that the filter is in the depot's window.

3.G : Replaced all mentions like "tram..." with "rail...". Added instructions to buy some wagons.

3.G : Fixed "It advances to the next step when the Whear mill receive 154t of grains" -> it's about the bakery receiving flour now, no longer about the wheat mill receiving grains.

3.H : Remplaced "modus" with "mode".

3.H.2 : Added instructions to use the lowering tool from landscaping tools toolbar.

3.H.3 : Added instructions to build a stretch of tunnel using the tunnel tool (and not to look for the regular tracks tool).

3.I : Added instruction to quit sliced underground mode.

3.I.5 : Added instruction to click several times to change direction of signals.

3.J.1 : Added instruction on how to use catenary tools (click at two connected points on the tracks to electrify the path from the first to the second, warned that it respects signals'direction).

3.J.3 : Added a note that only electrified depots show electric vehicles. Added a piece of information that the passenger train should be in the "electrics" tab, otherwise having electrified the tracks would not make sense.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #58 on: April 15, 2017, 05:39:10 PM »
Quote
In the en.tab file, in some couples, I modified the lower text as the upper one is used for matching with some hardcoded text (I suppose). Is it okay to have the hard coded text also modified so the en.tab becomes homogenous again?

Yes, it is a codified text, it is easier for me to handle the text strings in this way ... you must always modify the lower one to be assumed as a translation.


Check this out, I may have missed some text.

Modify only the lower text.

« Last Edit: April 15, 2017, 05:49:52 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #59 on: April 15, 2017, 07:32:35 PM »
What do you want me to  check ? If the English is good enough, if these lines are understandable by newbies, if everything in what I shared earlier has been taken into account ?

Anyway, there are some lines in Spanish in this text (line 225 to 234).

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #60 on: April 16, 2017, 01:55:47 AM »
Anyway, there are some lines in Spanish in this text (line 225 to 234).
It's for the next version. ;)



This needs corrections:
Quote
The roads:
This tool can be used by dragging the mouse or clicking from one point to another, you can also press the [Ctrl] key to build straight paths. There are several types of roads, these can vary their maximum speed from 30km / h to 200km / h. The maintenance of the roads is charged and costs vary depending on the type of road. It is also possible to electrify the roads to allow the passage of electric vehicles.

Deposits:
You can only build a deposit on an existing road and the edges of this (blind alley). From the depots it is possible to buy, sell, route and start the vehicles. There is also an option that allows electric vehicles to be used, but this is only shown if the road under the tank is electrified.

Bus Stops:
In order for the bus to be able to load passengers it is necessary that the stops are close to some building, tourist attraction or factory. The stops have a storage capacity of 32, 64 or more, in case of saturation you will be charged a penalty. It is also possible to combine them to increase their load capacity along with their coverage. You can also extend the load type using extension buildings or stations that accept different types of load..
« Last Edit: April 16, 2017, 04:03:53 AM by Yona-TYT »

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #61 on: April 16, 2017, 02:41:53 PM »
It would be very nice to be able to display images for the next version. :-[

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #62 on: April 22, 2017, 06:35:13 PM »
New version, although a little incomplete I'm afraid.  :-[

Scenario: Tutorial-v3.8 (New storage service courtesy of Isaac) ;)

Some of the changes are:
Implemented function to check vehicles in the depot (it's a pity that this does not work correctly, this is necessary).
You can start chapter 4 (work in progress)
[Chapter 3] Re-written step 8
I have moved the texts to a separate file (thinking about the future patch for images).
Tunnels and cruses are now marked
Some bug fixes

Added the following texts:
Quote
Chapter 2
________________________________________________Step 1_______________________________________________________________ __________
The roads:
This tool can be used by dragging the mouse or clicking from one point to another, you can also press the [Ctrl] key to build straight paths. There are several types of roads, these can vary their maximum speed from 30km / h to 200km / h. The maintenance of the roads is charged and costs vary depending on the type of road. It is also possible to electrify the roads to allow the passage of electric vehicles.

________________________________________________Step 2_______________________________________________________________ __________
Deposits:
You can only build a deposit on an existing road and the edges of this (blind alley). From the depots it is possible to buy, sell, route and start the vehicles. There is also an option that allows electric vehicles to be used, but this is only shown if the road under the tank is electrified.

________________________________________________Step 3_______________________________________________________________ __________
Bus Stops:
In order for the bus to be able to load passengers it is necessary that the stops are close to some building, tourist attraction or factory. The stops have a storage capacity of 32, 64 or more, in case of saturation you will be charged a penalty. It is also possible to combine them to increase their load capacity along with their coverage. You can also extend the load type using extension buildings or stations that accept different types of load..

Chapter 3
________________________________________________Step 8_______________________________________________________________ __________
__Pop-up window__
The slope is ready.
Lower the land here
First you must build a tunnel section.
First you must lower the layer level.
Modify the terrain here
________________________________________________Step 10______________________________________________________________ ___________
<h1>Electrified Trains:</h1>
The first step to use these trains is to electrify all the tracks, then in the deposit window select the tab Electrics.

Select Now:

>[a] A train {vna2}

Six wagons{vna3}

[c] A cabin {vna3}


Capture:




@gauthier
It is possible that I have lost some of your translations,  verify sure they are all in place.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2017, 07:51:08 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #63 on: May 01, 2017, 05:19:27 PM »
Better late than never, here is v4. I think it can already be included in pak128 (if everything works well clear). ;D

Scenario: tutorial-v4.0.zip (You need to use r8223)

Note: Chapter 4 is incomplete (a lot of work is missing)

Changes:
Some problems are fixed with the lines
Complete implementation of "is_convoy_allowed"
Improvements in is_schedule_allowed "
Some bug fixes.

Added the following texts:
Quote
Chapter 2

__Pop-up window__
You must first buy a bus [%s].
You must first buy a bus [%s].
Only one Bus is allowed, press the [Sell] button.
Only one Bus is allowed, press the [Sell] button.
Select the Bus [%s].
Select the Bus [%s].
Must not use trailers [%d].
Must not use trailers [%d].
The bus must be [Passengers].
The bus must be [Passengers].
The schedule is not correct.
The schedule is not correct.
It is not allowed to start vehicles.
It is not allowed to start vehicles.

Chapter 3
__Pop-up window__
Crates Deliverables
Crates Deliverables
You must first buy a locomotive [%s].
You must first buy a locomotive [%s].
Only one train is allowed, press the [Sell] button.
Only one train is allowed, press the [Sell] button.
Must choose a locomotive [%s].
Must choose a locomotive [%s].
The number of wagons must be [%d].
The number of wagons must be [%d].
All wagons must be for [%s].
All wagons must be for [%s].

Capture:
« Last Edit: May 01, 2017, 05:52:43 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #64 on: May 04, 2017, 10:03:40 PM »
Here the first stable version ;D .

Scenario: tutorial-v4.3.zip

Changes:
Chapter 4 is ready.
Translations for chapter 4.
Now only the necessary amount of vehicles in circulation is perimited.
Now it is only allowed to use the deposit indicated.
More improvements in line management.
More bug fixes.

Capture:
« Last Edit: May 04, 2017, 10:56:07 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #65 on: May 08, 2017, 07:42:21 AM »
Tested with r8233 (linux)

2.F.6/7: "Select the last stop ()" the name of the stop is missing.

3.B.1/5: The instruction should specify that tracks should be used.

3.C.1/2: I was able to build one piece of platform that does not accept goods (passengers instead), I was warned only at the second piece of platform. I don't have checked that with other stations.

3.H.2/5: Sliced underground "MODE" and not "MODUS", I let you replace all occurences of this in your files ;)

3.H.2/5: The instruction should specify that the down flat slope tool in the landscaping tools should be used here, otherwise the beginner has no idea of what he should do.

3.J.5/5: Stuck here, I tried to put one postal wagon in the convoy to see what happens, as expected the game did not allow me to dispatch a such convoy. The problem is that then, after replacing this postal wagon with a passenger car, having six cars as requested by the tutorial, it would not dispatch with an error message telling me that the convoy must have six cars (problem 1). I tried disassembling the convoy and recomposing it and then I could not use the schedule button (problem 2).

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #66 on: May 08, 2017, 03:30:39 PM »
Quote
2.F.6/7: "Select the last stop ()" the name of the stop is missing.
is resolved.

Quote
3.B.1/5: The instruction should specify that tracks should be used.
How about this:
Quote
Using the track tool, connect the two points between {w1} and {w2}.

Quote
3.C.1/2: I was able to build one piece of platform that does not accept goods (passengers instead), I was warned only at the second piece of platform. I don't have checked that with other stations.
It is because there is no direct way to differentiate between a passenger and good station, it can only be checked after building it, in that case it is necessary to use the tool to remove and build the station again.

Quote
3.H.2/5: Sliced underground "MODE" and not "MODUS", I let you replace all occurences of this in your files ;)
Only on one occasion.  :P

Quote
3.H.2/5: The instruction should specify that the down flat slope tool in the landscaping tools should be used here, otherwise the beginner has no idea of what he should do.
Can you modify this?

Quote
3.J.5/5: Stuck here, I tried to put one postal wagon in the convoy to see what happens, as expected the game did not allow me to dispatch a such convoy. The problem is that then, after replacing this postal wagon with a passenger car, having six cars as requested by the tutorial, it would not dispatch with an error message telling me that the convoy must have six cars (problem 1). I tried disassembling the convoy and recomposing it and then I could not use the schedule button (problem 2).
I do not know if I understand correctly, does the "Action not allowed" message appear when clicking on the stations?...  Can you send a savegame? (You can use the service: http://files.simutrans.com)


Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #67 on: May 12, 2017, 04:28:20 AM »
I release this version so that they have fun doing tests.  :P

Edit. (I have fixed a small error that allowed a jump from [5/10 to 7/10]).
Scenario: tutorial-v4.4.01.zip

The most important change:
[Chapter 3, step 10] Added 1 train for each of the stations (it was a bit difficult to achieve  :o ).


Capture:


Greetings. ;)
« Last Edit: May 13, 2017, 02:07:41 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #68 on: May 13, 2017, 08:23:33 AM »
2.B: "if the road under the tank is electrified", tank != depot !

2.D: Editing the schedule, if I remove a stop from the list, it stays "OK" in the tutorial window.

2.F.6/7: Set the last stop at 100% but the tutorial does not take to the next step although it took to the next step after closing the schedule window and dispatching the bus. I don't know how to reproduce this.

3.B: Still needs to specify that track tools are in railroad toolbar.

3.D: A small paragraph to tell the player how to know if a station accepts goods or anything else would be nice, something like "To know if a station accepts goods, let your cursor on the button and a tooltip pops up. A whole station accepts goods if at least one of its buildings does."

3.F: Would it be possible to hide elevated tracks buttons in this step ? Confusion with bridges is likely to happen.

3.H: The piece of track prebuilt on the steep slope is, in itself, a glitch but is not necessary to start the tunnel, everything would work great without it.

3.H.2/5: Should mention that "lowering the terrain" here means using the down flat artificial slope tool in the landscaping tools. A paragraph explaining how to use these tools to lower or raise underground tracks would be helpful.

3.J: After trying to make a postal train, selling it, and assembling the expected train, clicking on shedule, the tutorial window tells me to click on Cantebury Monumento -Estacion but clicking on it (on any platform) is an "action not allowed". Reloading the savegame before this step doesn't help. Once again I'm stuck.


During the whole tutorial, player can do stuff unrelated to the tutorial and is likely to break the tutorial at any point (nobody knows how a beginner thinks :p ). Would it be possible to implement things so that a player can only do the expected action ? I mean, instead of forbiding any other actions we can think of, forbid anything that is not a precise action ? That would make coding the scenario much easier and the scenario itself will be much more resistant to bugs.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #69 on: May 13, 2017, 02:04:29 PM »
3.J: After trying to make a postal train, selling it, and assembling the expected train, clicking on shedule, the tutorial window tells me to click on Cantebury Monumento -Estacion but clicking on it (on any platform) is an "action not allowed". Reloading the savegame before this step doesn't help. Once again I'm stuck.

The problem is that you must copy the train three times for a total of 4 trains, (I have fixed a small error that allowed a jump from [5/10 to 7/10]).


tutorial-4.4.01.zip

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #70 on: May 17, 2017, 01:07:57 AM »
Quote
2.B: "if the road under the tank is electrified", tank != depot !
It is fixed.

Quote
2.D: Editing the schedule, if I remove a stop from the list, it stays "OK" in the tutorial window.
I've improved a bit, but it's not possible to be perfect.
Quote
2.F.6/7: Set the last stop at 100% but the tutorial does not take to the next step although it took to the next step after closing the schedule window and dispatching the bus. I don't know how to reproduce this.
If you advance after pressing the start button, I have added more information here. ;)
Quote
3.B: Still needs to specify that track tools are in railroad toolbar.
What do you think of this ?: "Select" Railroad Tools "from the toolbar and choose the track tool to connect the two points between {w1} and {w2}.
 
"
Quote
3.D: A small paragraph to tell the player how to know if a station accepts goods or anything else would be nice, something like "To know if a station accepts goods, let your cursor on the button and a tooltip pops up. A whole station accepts goods if at least one of its buildings does."
Ok.

Quote
3.F: Would it be possible to hide elevated tracks buttons in this step ? Confusion with bridges is likely to happen.
The id of the tracks and the elevated tracks are the same, not with us another way of differentiating them I am afraid.

Quote
3.H: The piece of track prebuilt on the steep slope is, in itself, a glitch but is not necessary to start the tunnel, everything would work great without it.
The problem is that the track and the entrance of the tunnel are not automatically logged when the track belongs to the public service.

Quote
3.H.2/5: Should mention that "lowering the terrain" here means using the down flat artificial slope tool in the landscaping tools. A paragraph explaining how to use these tools to lower or raise underground tracks would be helpful.
That can be explained very well using images (I still hope that the patch is incorporated).

Quote
During the whole tutorial, player can do stuff unrelated to the tutorial and is likely to break the tutorial at any point (nobody knows how a beginner thinks :p ). Would it be possible to implement things so that a player can only do the expected action ? I mean, instead of forbiding any other actions we can think of, forbid anything that is not a precise action ? That would make coding the scenario much easier and the scenario itself will be much more resistant to bugs.
Without doubts that yes, but this is not implemented in the script, nor do I believe that some developer willing to implement it I fear. :-[

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #71 on: May 17, 2017, 02:43:14 AM »
Here is another version to continue extending the list. :P

Scenario: tutorial-v4.5.zip

Most changes are for Chapter 2.

Changes:
[Chapter 2] New step that allows to start three vehicles.
[Chapter 2] "LIAZ 677" buses are now being used.
Some corrections in the texts.

Capture:



Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #72 on: May 22, 2017, 07:24:40 AM »
I noticed that you made player unable to pause the game, nice :p

Chapter 2 [1/3][4,5,6,7,8,9,10] : are all the same instruction.
Chapter 2 [1/3][11] : At the end, there are only two stops in the line, no point of using "copy backward".
Chapter 2 [1/3][12] : At closing the schedule window, I get an error popup about a waypoint not in place. The line remains empty after that.
Chapter 2 [1/3] : "when all vehicles are in circulation." what "all" vehicles ? There's no instruction about buying several ones or copying the one I bought.

Stuck there.

I'm confused as I often run into problems like this, and please forgive me if I get a little offensive ... do you actually test your scenario before uploading it ?

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #73 on: May 22, 2017, 08:26:47 PM »
Quote
Chapter 2 [1/3][4,5,6,7,8,9,10] : are all the same instruction.
It is fixed.

Quote
Chapter 2 [1/3][11] : At the end, there are only two stops in the line, no point of using "copy backward".
I do not understand, why not use this button? ... It seems useful to me that the vehicle travels all the stops to the return. ???

Quote
Chapter 2 [1/3][12] : At closing the schedule window, I get an error popup about a waypoint not in place. The line remains empty after that.
I can not replicate its error, in fact I have tried many times and nothing.
Try updating your version of simutrans, and try again.
I would also like to check out a savegame.

Quote
Chapter 2 [1/3] : "when all vehicles are in circulation." what "all" vehicles ? There's no instruction about buying several ones or copying the one I bought.
Stuck there.
In this step try to teach to use the lines, it is not allowed to copy the vehicles so that the player is forced to use the lines. What you should do is buy a vehicle, assign the line you just created and start it.
I thought this was a good idea, but if you do not think so then I change it.

Quote
I'm confused as I often run into problems like this, and please forgive me if I get a little offensive ... do you actually test your scenario before uploading it ?

Offended? No, not at all, but I'm happy that somebody help me to test this, since this scenario is extremely complicated.

The truth is I have to do a lot of testing before releasing a new version, but for some reason some errors always escape.  :o

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #74 on: May 31, 2017, 03:21:53 AM »
Tutorial-v5.0

Scenario  -->  tutorial-v5.0.zip  (Needs the r8242 or higher).


Very happy to announce two major changes in this version:  ;D ;D ;D
1-Now can be recovered vehicles deleted:
If for some reason you delete a vehicle in circulation or send it to the deposit, the scenario will return the chapter / step so that you can recover it.

2-A link to advance in passing (chapters 1 and 2 only):
It works like the links towards coordinates, but in this one execute functions that allow to complete and to advance of step ...  thanks to dwachs http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=17135.msg163121#msg163121.





Quote
Chapter 2 [1/3][12] : At closing the schedule window, I get an error popup about a waypoint not in place. The line remains empty after that.
@gauthier
I can not replicate the problem, but I suspect it may be caused by this: http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=17140.0
« Last Edit: May 31, 2017, 03:32:46 AM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #75 on: June 06, 2017, 08:43:38 PM »
Quote
I do not understand, why not use this button? ... It seems useful to me that the vehicle travels all the stops to the return. ???
I had only two stops in the line. I suspect there should be more.
As soon as I test your v5.0 I tell you if I run again into this.

Quote
During the whole tutorial, player can do stuff unrelated to the tutorial and is likely to break the tutorial at any point (nobody knows how a beginner thinks :p ). Would it be possible to implement things so that a player can only do the expected action ? I mean, instead of forbiding any other actions we can think of, forbid anything that is not a precise action ? That would make coding the scenario much easier and the scenario itself will be much more resistant to bugs.
This solution should really be considered. It's obvious that achieving a bug-proof tutorial will be a long and painful way. If implementing an "only-one-permitted-action" logic is not possible in the tutorials as they are coded currently, that is probably not so difficult to implement. You could ask developers about that.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #76 on: June 07, 2017, 05:24:47 AM »
Yes, I have seen this in tutorials of other games, and I really would like this.
Unfortunately I do not think this is implemented, because of the following:
1- Complication of the code: We all know how complicated is the simutrans code.  :o 
2- Availability of the developers: I think we only have a single developer in the script part and its availability is very limited (in fact a few days ago I expect answers to some problems).  :-[ 
3- Do developers like the idea ?: If they do not like it just will not happen, even in some cases I have provided codes for implementation, but nothing ... you can see here that most of the themes are mine. --> http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?board=143.0
Either way, I think it's always worthwhile to post an idea.  ;)

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #77 on: July 13, 2017, 02:46:26 PM »
Version 6.0 is ready !.  ;D ;D ;D ;D

The most important thing is that you can now skip steps in Chapter 3.

I have also solved some problems with the convoys in the process.

Scenario --> tutorial-v6.0.zip


Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #78 on: August 25, 2017, 03:38:11 AM »
I leave here the final version of Tutorial, hopefully it will be included in the next release of pak128. :P

Scenario -> tutorial-v6.2.01

The only major change is the support for the  button: "Promote to line -> http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=17140.0".

I hope you like it, greetings!!. ;D


Edit.

v6.2.01 A small error is fixed.
 
« Last Edit: October 15, 2017, 02:55:54 PM by Yona-TYT »

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #79 on: August 28, 2017, 07:14:38 PM »
Hey ! Don't worry, I have not forgotten your tutorial. I will test this as soon as possible and if it's newbie-proof enough, it will surely be included in pak128's next release ... wait ... what next release ? :p

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #80 on: August 29, 2017, 10:33:48 PM »
it will surely be included in pak128's next release ... wait ... what next release ? :p




Well I hope to be alive to see the next version of pak128.  :P

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #81 on: August 31, 2017, 07:31:22 PM »
Yes, I know. It's been a long time. I did some things which are commited to the SVN since the next release but now I feel bad releasing a new version, ages after the previous one, with only little fixes and .dat improvements  :-[

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #82 on: October 04, 2017, 07:12:42 PM »
Everything is in the screenshot. Juste after buying the bus, I get the error window poping several times a second. (Simutrans 120.2.3 rr8233 with Linux x64).

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #83 on: October 05, 2017, 02:16:12 AM »
Everything is in the screenshot. Juste after buying the bus, I get the error window poping several times a second. (Simutrans 120.2.3 rr8233 with Linux x64).

Hello friend, how are you? ... thanks for test the script.

The error is because the function "convoy_x :: is_in_depot" is available from r8235 onwards ;).

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #84 on: October 05, 2017, 05:05:22 PM »
Oh indeed, I forgot that your tutorial uses some not-released-yet features, my bad ! I will test again soon.

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #85 on: October 14, 2017, 02:33:15 PM »
I still get stuck :/

These comments are only my opinion and I won't mind if you disagree with some of them and choose not to apply them. Some of them might repeat older comments as I don't remember all that has been said.

The debug tab of the scenario information window should be removed for an actual release.

2.A: typo "once the beginning" instead of "once on the beginning"

2.B: I suggest "You can only build a depot on dead ends." instead of "You can only build a depot on an existing road and the edges of this (blind alley)." (overcomplicated and so unclear formulation)

2.C: "In case of saturation you will be charged a penalty.", as far as I know it's not the way it works. A saturated stop just stops generating new passengers or goods.

2.D: I don't know if this is fixable: stop lines in the scenario information are red again after closing the schedule window.

2.F.1: No big deal but still: I would replace "necessary" with "useful". I would also add that the line management window can be accessed through the key "w".

Problem here but same at many places "when all vehicles are in circulation" seems to apply to 2.F.1 alone whereas it applies to the whole 2.F part. Maybe a horizontal line or something to visually separate these ?

2.F.2: The instructions [3] and [4] might be confusing as one can modify a line only through the line management window which is, at this point of the tutorial, not necessarily opened (I chose to create my line through the depot's window). In my opinion these two instructions can be removed.

2.F: I have a total of two buses serving the line, the toturial does not proceed to the next step. It proceeds only if I buy a third bus.
By the way, this section would be a great place to talk about the copy convoy button.

2.G: "when the bus arrives at a stop in Lancaster" this is false, the tutorial proceeded to the next step as soon as the bus left the depot.

3.B: "Whoose the track tool", incorrect formulation as they are several track tools. A paragraph explaining that faster ways are more expensive and that one should think about it before building would be great. Then the player would be advised to built 60 or 80 kmph tracks.

3.F: why the hell is there an army or star labels invading my tracks ? :p

So this step is bugged and I'm stuck (again). The tutorial scenario says to connect the points (38, 2, 1) and (68, 18, 2), directly connecting them is not allowed. I follow the labels "Build rails form here!.", I cannot build tracks on (44, 2, 1), in fact I was only able to build a section between (38, 2, 1) and (41, 2, 1). Then the piece of tracks in (41, 2, 1) is highlited in red but I cannot build farther.

Offline Yona-TYT

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #86 on: October 15, 2017, 02:51:51 PM »
It's ready, just a silly mistake on my part.   ;)


Scenario -> http://files.simutrans.com/index.php/s/uvtcoFRJ1tPKT9j



I'm afraid I do not have time to correct the translations.  :-[
If you send me the modified files, I gladly add them. regards !.

Offline Frank

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #87 on: October 15, 2017, 07:48:16 PM »
...
I'm afraid I do not have time to correct the translations.  :-[
If you send me the modified files, I gladly add them. regards !.

The texts are partly imported into the Translator.

Set: Scenario Tutorial pak128

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #88 on: October 18, 2017, 05:54:13 AM »
It's ready, just a silly mistake on my part.   ;)


Scenario -> http://files.simutrans.com/index.php/s/uvtcoFRJ1tPKT9j
Hence the importance of always running a complete and rigorous test before every release, and this principle applies to all kinds of computer development ;) I'm testing this as soon as possible !

Offline gauthier

Re: Pak128 Scenario Tutorial
« Reply #89 on: October 20, 2017, 09:46:18 AM »
In addition of the comments I already made:

In the first steps (click on Isaac and on the town hall) when I click where expected, an empty message window appears.

2.H: problems with English translation: "Paso H", and "Public Stoppages" instead of "public stops".

3.G: Stars invasion again at the end of the step.

3.H.1: The piece of tracks on the slope where the player is supposed to start a tunnel is actually the result of a glitch/bug/unexpected-feature and might be confusing for beginners. As this piece is not necessary to start the tunnel and have it immediately connected to the tracks in front of it, it could be removed.

3.H.2: Since the player is instructed to set the layer level to 0, a note to tell him that this level is displayed in the toolbar, on the sliced underground mode button, would be great.

3.H.2: I think I already reported this one: "lower the terrain at the end of the tunnel" stays unclear to the player about what tool he should do this with (landscaping toolbar, lower flat slope tool).

3.I.5: Even if there is a note on how to set a signal's direction, player has no clue on how he has to set it to be OK. You could add a note telling that here the signals are in the good direction if there is only one signal outside the pair of tracks at each location.

3.I.5: Typos in the labels "Place Singnal here !."

3.J: The way you set train service here is quite ... unusual. Rio des Abajo is always served in only one direction by trains passing through it, and why having four different schedules when there is an obvious solution of having one line serving Cantebury - Rio de abajo - Westminster and backwards, and another line serving Cantebury and Lancaster ?

4.A: "oil" would be just enough instead of "hydrocarbons (petroleum)".

4.B: Please precise that docks have to be for goods (not passengers or mail).

4.E.1: The labels say "Build Track here!" instead of "Build canal here!".

4.E.2: There should be a not precising that canal need specific canal stops and not docks like on shores.

4.E.4: "You need 5 ships are needed" ;)

4.F: "Paso F" in English. No text is displayed in the scenario goal, I had to guess what to do, look for labels on the map, ...

4.G: "Paso G" in English. Same as before, no text displayed. I figured out with the error messages that I should have five ships, that the line should instruct to wait for 100% load at max 1/1 of month at Centebury, but I was unable to figure out what ship to use. Finally, when trying to start a Gripsholm on that line, an error message told me that I had to use a tanker. -> stuck again.