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Author Topic: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation  (Read 343 times)

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Offline passengerpigeon

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[BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« on: May 12, 2020, 01:58:20 PM »
Whenever I created a world using Carl Baker's now-discontinued Pak64.Experimental, version 0.4, and the city and general configuration files here attached, cities would be tiny no matter what I set the population size to, and clicking on them with the public player's Grow City feature only grew them very slowly. Any idea what the cause of this is?

Offline passengerpigeon

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2020, 10:01:33 AM »
Addendum: I have also tried setting "quick city growth" to 1 (enabled) with Pak128.Britain-Extended, and it causes this same problem, meaning that this, not the city generation rules, is the cause of the issue. Is it possible to use the default city generation algorithm with new versions of Simutrans.Extended? I know that there is a comment saying to increase the renovation percentage if quick city growth is enabled, but I tried cranking that up to 500 to no avail.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2020, 10:12:49 AM by passengerpigeon »

Offline Spenk009

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2020, 12:14:07 PM »
There may be a different problem with the discontinued Pak64.Exp, even if the behaviour looks similar. You could look into the difference in configuration files and possibly buildings' timeline availability to see whether there are some obvious hints. If I'm not mistaken, Carl's pakset is also intended for the videos rather than a real game which may cause a behaviour of small cities to reduce renovation during modelling.

Offline passengerpigeon

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2020, 08:12:39 AM »
There may be a different problem with the discontinued Pak64.Exp, even if the behaviour looks similar. You could look into the difference in configuration files and possibly buildings' timeline availability to see whether there are some obvious hints. If I'm not mistaken, Carl's pakset is also intended for the videos rather than a real game which may cause a behaviour of small cities to reduce renovation during modelling.

As far as I know, his recent releases of Pak64 were made just for map projects, but the discontinued Pak64.Experimental was meant to be economically balanced for real games. I have looked at length through the config files for clues but couldn't find any, and the intro dates don't look like they should cause any issues.

Edit: I have noticed that there are no residential buildings with a low level; all of the buildings have higher levels than in the default Pak64. I am currently editing the .dat files to fix this.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2020, 09:47:41 AM by passengerpigeon »

Offline jamespetts

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2020, 07:16:25 PM »
I have identified an issue that there is some non-trivial possibility has some causative impact on the described problem here. A modification has been made to the code. You might want to re-test with to-morrow's nightly build.

Offline passengerpigeon

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2020, 11:12:29 AM »
I have identified an issue that there is some non-trivial possibility has some causative impact on the described problem here. A modification has been made to the code. You might want to re-test with to-morrow's nightly build.

I have retried this with the nightly build; Pak128.Britain is no different with quick city growth turned on (still tiny towns), and Pak64.Exp seems to have broken completely, with all possible starting dates being highlighted in red and no towns being able to generate when the map is spawned; this is the case with both the default Pak64 and Pak128 Extended city generation.

Offline jamespetts

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2020, 12:13:22 PM »
I have retried this with the nightly build; Pak128.Britain is no different with quick city growth turned on (still tiny towns), and Pak64.Exp seems to have broken completely, with all possible starting dates being highlighted in red and no towns being able to generate when the map is spawned; this is the case with both the default Pak64 and Pak128 Extended city generation.

Thank you for letting me know. Have you tried it with quick city growth turned off?

Offline Freahk

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2020, 12:17:18 PM »
Pak128.Britain is no different with quick city growth turned on (still tiny towns)

The first part of quick city growth is the exact same as standards city growth.
The second part it shares in common with some features added in extended, one of them being shortages, so I still believe it might be related.

Offline passengerpigeon

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2020, 02:01:27 AM »
Thank you for letting me know. Have you tried it with quick city growth turned off?

Yes; Pak64.Exp is still broken with the date bug and Pak128.Britain works fine. Also, I noticed that I am no longer allowed to build single-height bridges over navigable rivers; is this a bug, considering the initial bridges that generate with the world are single-height?

Offline Freahk

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Re: [BUG] (Pak64) Tiny towns with default city generation
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2020, 06:31:55 AM »
No, this is a feature to prevent players from cutting other players routes which might require high clearance under bridges.
I guess you can set this behavior in simuconf using way_height_clearance, just as in standard ;)