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Offline jamespetts

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Know your horses
« on: May 28, 2020, 11:17:56 PM »
There follows some useful information for players in the pre-motor-car era of the game where horses are an important form of transport. In the Bridgewater-Brunel server game, I often notice players using unsuitable types of horses for various tasks, causing their transport to be unnecessarily inefficient. This information is intended to help players to pick the right type of horse for the task in hand.

Types of horse

There are two basic types of horse:

(1) the draught horse; and
(2) the coaching horse.

Each have their own strengths, weaknesses and ideal applications.

Draught horses

The draught horses in Pak128.Britain-Ex are:

(1) the Irish Draught horse;
(2) the Shire horse; and
(3) the Clydesdale horse.

Draught horses are stocky and strong, good at hauling heavy loads up difficult terrain. They are not fast, but they can pull a good load at a modest speed over long distances without tiring.

Ideal uses for draught horses

- Hauling goods carts and wagons on the road
- Hauling canal boats
- Hauling heavy freight wagons on waggonways (early railways)
- Hauling heavy local passenger omnibuses that carry a large number of passengers at a modest speed
- Hauling local trams that carry a large number of passengers at a modest speed

Coaching horses

The coaching horses in Pak128.Britain-Ex are:

(1) the Feresian horse;
(2) the Hackney horse;
(3) the Cleveland Bay horse; and
(4) the Yorkshire coach horse.

Coach horses are fast and slender. They are good at hauling modest loads at high speeds, especially over relatively easy terrain. However, because they travel at higher speeds, they tire easily and need to be changed/rested after a time, so their range is limited.

Ideal uses for coaching horses

- Pulling stagecoaches on roads (usually in teams of 4 or 6)
- Pulling short stagecoaches on roads (usually in teams of 4)
- Pulling stagecoaches on waggonways (early railways; usually singly)
- Pulling mail coaches on roads
- Pulling flyboats on canals

Horses and rails

Because vehicles that run on rails have much less rolling resistance than vehicles on a road, horses pulling a carriage or tram on a waggonway/railway can haul it much more easily than the same load on an ordinary road. This means that fewer horses are required for the same load, or a higher load can be pulled with the same number of horses. A rail stage coach, for example, can operate as an ordinary stage coach, but with a single horse instead of a team of 6. A horse tram can carry far more people than a horse bus with the same number of horses and at the same speed.

The pony

This is a miscellaneous category of horse. It is intended to be used to haul small carts of goods or mail where it is not economically viable to use other types of horse. It is neither strong nor fast, but it is cheap. Players might find ponies useful for, e.g., carting small quantities of goods from docks or railway stations to local shops, or carting very small quantities of goods from multiple farms to a factory or market in a nearby town.

Offline freddyhayward

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2020, 02:21:16 AM »
I have generally used Irish Draught horses for stagecoaches, because the improved speed of other horses tends to be negated by slower climbing hills and being delayed by slower traffic, although I don't know how large this effect is.

Offline Ranran

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2020, 08:45:48 AM »
Thanks for the helpful information.  :) I've only used horses with the highest traction so far  :-[

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2020, 12:56:40 PM »
I have generally used Irish Draught horses for stagecoaches, because the improved speed of other horses tends to be negated by slower climbing hills and being delayed by slower traffic, although I don't know how large this effect is.

You should use a team of 6 Feresian horses for stagecoaches - unless the hill is very steep, these should be able to manage it at a sensible speed, even if not maximum speed. Unless your route is extremely hilly, most time will be spent on the flat, and thus the superior speed of a coach horse on the flat will be much more important than any improved speed of a draught horse on a hill.

Speed is now more important for passenger transport than it was until the most recent changes owing to the reduction of average journey time tolerances.

Offline Freahk

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2020, 01:30:31 PM »
For the same reasons as freddy mentioned, I don't consider coaching horses to be worth it currently.
On intercity lines, you will be stuck behind an 8 km/h private coach anyways and within cities it's often worth more to pull up a slope at reasonably speed, instead of 1 km/h as 6 Fresians do as soon as there is more than a single half-height slope involved.

So there is no reasonable advantage in using fresians at cost of lower slope speeds and higher costs.
The only exception where I actually consider Fresians preferable over Irish draught is on intercity lines with dedicated private roads.

Anyways, I do also use 6 Fresians on intercity lines sharing roads with slow private coaches, but that's rather because James complained about my Draughts early on, than for economical reasons.
Might be the economics changed now, I'll need to reconsider building more dedicated private roads.

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2020, 01:54:22 PM »
I have now temporarily modified the speed of the private horse carts to 12km/h. The long-term solution is a better system for overtaking, however.

Offline Vladki

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2020, 07:32:11 PM »
Regarding the comparison of road and rail transport pulled by horses. There is record from opening the horse railway Budweis - Linz. The builders claimed that horse will be able to pull 10x more load on railway than on road. A test was done and the result was even better: 30x more load. (on flat track). Another record - first ride with material for construction on the unfinished railway was 14 tons pulled easily by 2 horses for 30 km.
All around average weight pulled by one horse on rail was 3920 kg vs. 560 kg on road. However on the steepest part of track (2.17 %) two horses were required to pull one wagon with 2.5 tons of payload. Horse changing stations were approx every 20-22 km, horses did 2x20 km per day (both freight and passenger). Each stage took about 2 hours (passengers) or 4 hours (freight). Passenger train consisted of two carriages pulled by two horses.  On the steep part, the train had to be divided, and horses added - so only 1 car with 2 horses. I don't know what breed of horses was used.

BTW: multi-modal transport (Ro-Ro trains) is as old as that. Rich people could have had their own coaches put on flat railway wagon.
Also paying for overweight baggage was required on that railway. The final part of track were laid over the streets of Budweis so it was a tram as well.

Offline Milko

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2020, 08:57:03 PM »
Hello

The long-term solution is a better system for overtaking, however.

I agree, actually my convoys are always all in the queue behind very slow carriages and never overtake them. Am I wrong or does overtaking work some time ago?

Giuseppe

Offline Freahk

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2020, 09:14:29 PM »
It does work, but there is a minimum speeed difference which must be exceeded, otherwise vehicles won't attempt to overtake.
If I recall correctly, that threshold is 10 km/h.
Further, the whole way required for overtaking needs to be in sight and cleared.

These two requirements result in overtaking happening veeeeeeeeeery rarely in early years.
Although, it can rarely be observed in stop-and-go situations on oneway roads, as these are not restricted by sighting.

Offline Ranran

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2020, 09:31:18 AM »
I increased the number of horses for freight and mail to run at 10km/h, but it seems that horses running at 6km/h often obstruct the running, and the cost for that is almost useless.  ::-\

Offline freddyhayward

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2020, 09:42:17 AM »
I increased the number of horses for freight and mail to run at 10km/h, but it seems that horses running at 6km/h often obstruct the running, and the cost for that is almost useless.  ::-\
I have also found this. Is overtaking intended to work for two-way roads? It currently only works for one-way.

Offline Vladki

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2020, 02:58:37 PM »
If I recall correctly, that threshold is 10 km/h.
How about changing the threshold to be in % ? Or a different threshold for speeds < 20 km/h ?

Offline wlindley

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2020, 03:27:22 PM »
Perhaps change to: A can overtake B, if A's target speed is greater than B's speed shift-left-by-three (i.e., 1/8th or 12.5%) — a simple calculation instead of the greater-than-B's-speed-plus-10…

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Know your horses
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2020, 10:43:27 AM »
I have already changed the overtaking calculation to use a greater than plus two formula. I have tested this and it does work in ideal conditions, so it is not correct that overtaking does not work on two way roads.

However, the overtaking code is extremely complex, and takes into account far more than speed: it also takes into account whether there is enough space ahead before reaching an intersection to complete the overtaking move.

I did not write the overtaking code and do not know exactly how it works. Amending it beyond simply reducing the speed differential would be an extremely large project and not one that I can prioritise until after economic balancing has been achieved.

If anyone else would like to look into this, this would be most useful.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2020, 10:55:13 AM by jamespetts »