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Author Topic: BR Class 222  (Read 1458 times)

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Offline jonbridg

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BR Class 222
« on: July 01, 2020, 07:16:04 PM »
Hi all,
Been on the forums a while and not got involved much, but I've been tinkering on and off with Blender for a while and after a recent effort to get makeobj to work, I can present this Class 222:



With thanks to Kieron whose Class 220/221 Voyager model I modified and repainted. I've still research to finish for the dat file (and need to learn how to use Github!) before I can release it.

As per the prototype the the model is essentially a Voyager with higher Comfort and Catering ratings; do people think the Class 220 be made obsolete when the class 222 is introduced? Edit: Another question: I've set up the constraints so that all trains have a 3rd-class buffet car and a 1st-class kitchen as per the prototype, but since the kitchen is in a Driving vehicle and Simutrans doesn't seem to support two-class catering, it rather makes the buffet redundant. Any thoughts?

« Last Edit: July 01, 2020, 08:03:11 PM by jonbridg »

Offline kierongreen

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2020, 10:02:27 AM »
I thought there was a trend for standard class buffets to (sadly) become more or less extinct in real life anyway... Main advantage Class 222 had over 220/1 in real life was that it had more train equipment put under the carriage which frees up space within the unit for passengers and luggage. That's because they aren't designed to have ability to retrofit tilt.

Offline TheRoadmaster1996

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2020, 03:44:45 PM »
Let me ask you guys a question I've been wondering. Since the start of AMTRAK here in the States, our railroads have gone down hill in regard to passenger services. It's just not the same as when we still had the famous streamliners and well known named trains when people took train rides for its world class services. So here's my question: How does modern British railways stack up to the old days before nationalization? Is taking a train to see the British countryside just as good as it was a hundred years ago?

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2020, 04:36:19 PM »
Let me ask you guys a question I've been wondering. Since the start of AMTRAK here in the States, our railroads have gone down hill in regard to passenger services. It's just not the same as when we still had the famous streamliners and well known named trains when people took train rides for its world class services. So here's my question: How does modern British railways stack up to the old days before nationalization? Is taking a train to see the British countryside just as good as it was a hundred years ago?

On any line which is electrified with overhead wires, no. On any line which is unelectrified or electrified with either third rail and forth rail, yes

Offline Freahk

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2020, 04:42:49 PM »
What's wrong about catenaries?

Offline Vladki

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2020, 05:25:20 PM »
to see the British countryside
Catenary poles reduce the quality of sight seeing from trains, especially if you want to make photos during the ride. According to murphy's law, there is 90% chance of a pole getting into the picture.

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2020, 07:37:56 PM »
Catenary poles reduce the quality of sight seeing from trains, especially if you want to make photos during the ride. According to murphy's law, there is 90% chance of a pole getting into the picture.

There's your answer @Freahk ;)

Offline TheRoadmaster1996

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2020, 08:24:28 PM »
But Britain in the 1920s had electrified lines as well correct? I'm talking about service such as food, how luxurious the cars are, that sort of stuff. AMTRAK is alright and travailing by rail is still the best way to see America but the cars are not as luxurious and many cars have the feeling of airplane cabins.

Offline Freahk

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2020, 10:25:10 AM »
Well I have actually never felt cetenary poles to disrupt my vision to the surrounding landscape.
Comfort is steadily decreasing even though they sell each new generation of train as "super confortable".

In fact, they do simply define comfort differently. Free wifi, low floor, air conditioning that does actually work at hot summer days is adverted for but the seating density is increasing at cost of comfort each time.
That's in Germany and it felt even worse in Ireland, though the smaller loading gauge did very likely play a role there. I have no idea about comfort in the UK.

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2020, 12:01:02 PM »
I thought there was a trend for standard class buffets to (sadly) become more or less extinct in real life anyway...
Yes, and checking the East Midlands Railway website (currently the sole operator of Class 222) it seems standard class only gets a trolley service now. For now I'll leave the buffet vehicle in the formation but it won't incur extra costs.

But Britain in the 1920s had electrified lines as well correct? I'm talking about service such as food, how luxurious the cars are, that sort of stuff. AMTRAK is alright and travailing by rail is still the best way to see America but the cars are not as luxurious and many cars have the feeling of airplane cabins.
It did; from the 1930s the electric Brighton Belle trains were one of, if not the, most luxurious trains in the Britain. But such was rare: most electric railways were commuter lines where the priority was shifting as many people as possible, a policy which has spread to inter-city services today with airline-style seating that doesn't line up with the windows, and the replacement of restaurants and buffets with extra seats and a food trolley. It's certainly less comfortable, but in a small country like the UK where you can drive to most places in less than a day the focus now is on frequency of services (and speed to a lesser extent).

PS I'm from the UK and can confirm the loading gauge is as cramped as it is in Ireland, if not worse; particularly for tilting trains.  For this reason we've never had proper double-decker (bilevel) trains, sadly.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2020, 12:21:34 PM by jonbridg »

Offline Freahk

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2020, 12:24:10 PM »
Yes, and checking the East Midlands Railway website (currently the sole operator of Class 222) it seems standard class only gets a trolley service now
That's crazy o.O

Here, either trains have a board restaurant, or not. If it has one, everyone can spend his hard earned money to purchase, for example, a warmed-up chilli con carne and, to fullfill the clicé, a beer for 13€ at the restaurant.

The new "modern and comfortable" bilevel IC2 fleet does not have a restaurant, so trolleys are used there, not to mention poor service employment has to carry the trollyey upstairs and downstairs each car.
In fact, this fleet resulted from a contract DB Regio made that they did not need anymore because they lost some open competitive biddings, whilst DB long distance noticed it might be time to renew their fleet, which was still running a few cars from the 1970s, so they adjusted the contract to another interior and we do now have actually rather uncomfortable and slow long-distance trains.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2020, 12:35:09 PM by Freahk »

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2020, 01:28:25 PM »
Yes, and checking the East Midlands Railway website (currently the sole operator of Class 222) it seems standard class only gets a trolley service now. For now I'll leave the buffet vehicle in the formation but it won't incur extra costs.

Prior to recent times, the buffet on the Class 222 was in use and whilst it isn't the same as the mini-supermarkets on the Class 220/221's they do serve food and drink

Offline TheRoadmaster1996

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2020, 03:27:41 PM »
Wait... your trains across the pond have mini-supermarkets? Man, AMTRAK doesn't have services like that! America's railroads really have gone downhill since the 70's.

Offline Vladki

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2020, 04:30:09 PM »
Do you mean that in UK, the buffet or restaurant car is only for first class passengers?

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2020, 06:24:30 PM »
Do you mean that in UK, the buffet or restaurant car is only for first class passengers?

No, the buffet and restaurant cars can be used by both first and standard class passengers. However in first class, people get an exclusive premium service (i.e. cooked meals)

Wait... your trains across the pond have mini-supermarkets? Man, AMTRAK doesn't have services like that! America's railroads really have gone downhill since the 70's.

Yes on Avanti West Coast trains

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2020, 07:17:11 PM »
It depends on the train operator: the few GWR trains that offer a restaurant (early morning trains to London, if I recall) do serve cooked food to standard-class passengers if there is space, but this is limited since first-class passengers are allowed to book ahead.

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #16 on: July 03, 2020, 07:26:02 PM »
It depends on the train operator: the few GWR trains that offer a restaurant (early morning trains to London, if I recall) do serve cooked food to standard-class passengers if there is space, but this is limited since first-class passengers are allowed to book ahead.

Restaurant trains are only on intercity services to/from London and mostly operate on weekdays (Monday-Friday) with there being a trolley service and/or a buffet (a shop if on an Avanti service) for standard (second) class passengers

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #17 on: July 04, 2020, 03:50:48 PM »
An update: I have successfully created repositories for the blend files...

https://github.com/jonbridg/Pak128.britain-blends

...and dat/png files...

https://github.com/jonbridg/simutrans-pak128.britain

...as per jamespetts' helpful tutorial, thank you for that! I am currently sorting out a constraint bug, then I can push the files to my repositories.


Offline TheRoadmaster1996

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #18 on: July 04, 2020, 04:41:50 PM »
Can you post a link to the tutorial? I've been trying to find a way to post my stuff for a while.

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #19 on: July 04, 2020, 05:55:23 PM »

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2020, 01:45:33 AM »

Constraint bug solved, may I now present the completed liveries. If there's anything that doesn't look right, please let me know! From left to right: First Hull Trains, East Midlands Railway, East Midlands Trains and Midland Mainline.

At the moment two of the liveries are linked to the wrong name to make them work; is there a master list somewhere to add new ones? I can't seem to find one in the pak repository.

Offline TheRoadmaster1996

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2020, 02:22:16 AM »
https://code.tutsplus.com/tutorials/git-on-windows-for-newbs--net-25847

Which is from Stage 1 of jamespetts' tutorial: https://forum.simutrans.com/index.php/topic,17510.0.html

Hope this helps! I also found these useful, particularly since I use Linux:

https://docs.github.com/en

https://guides.github.com/activities/hello-world/

Thank you. I tried uploading something to github today so somebody could help me compile Simutrans Extended with U.S. units and did it wrong.

Offline TheRoadmaster1996

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2020, 02:23:42 AM »
For liveries

I was actually going to ask about if you were planning on doing different liveries but you answered my question.

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2020, 12:11:34 PM »

Constraint bug solved, may I now present the completed liveries. If there's anything that doesn't look right, please let me know! From left to right: First Hull Trains, East Midlands Railway, East Midlands Trains and Midland Mainline.

At the moment two of the liveries are linked to the wrong name to make them work; is there a master list somewhere to add new ones? I can't seem to find one in the pak repository.

This is brilliant. I hope that this is the start of more trains been added to the pakset and I do hope to see more trains from you in the future 👍🏾

Offline Rollmaterial

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2020, 01:58:45 PM »
The livery definitions are at the bottom of the pakset simuconf.tab. Hull Trains, Midland Mainline and East Midland Trains are already defined, but EMR isn't yet.

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2020, 09:51:21 PM »
This is brilliant. I hope that this is the start of more trains been added to the pakset and I do hope to see more trains from you in the future 👍🏾
Glad to hear it, there's certainly lots I'd like to do! I'd also be happy to help if there's any priority work; re-rendering with the new workflow, etc.

Thanks very much Rollmaterial, new livery duly appended and working (only for new maps it seems, but it's something).

Edit: additions pushed to my github repositories. If I understand correctly, these need to be merged into the master pakset by jamespetts? If so I'll PM tomorrow.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2020, 11:37:43 PM by jonbridg »

Offline jamespetts

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2020, 11:16:19 PM »
Thank you very much for that. I have done some testing; but there are two things that need to be done before I can incorporate this. First of all, we need English translation texts for the names. Secondly, the white needs to be made darker (I suggest 85% rather than 100% luminance), as these intense, burnt out whites do not work well with the other colours in the pakset and detail is lost on the carriage sides.

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #27 on: July 10, 2020, 04:05:22 PM »
https://photos.app.goo.gl/97fGwBsLFzSNGGjk9

Thanks for the feedback, how about this? I've added the translation names to en.tab (and amended the Hull Trains livery, the gold was a bit orange for my liking) and they're ready to push.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2020, 04:27:41 PM by jonbridg »

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #28 on: July 10, 2020, 08:05:12 PM »
https://photos.app.goo.gl/97fGwBsLFzSNGGjk9

Thanks for the feedback, how about this? I've added the translation names to en.tab (and amended the Hull Trains livery, the gold was a bit orange for my liking) and they're ready to push.

Are my eyes been deceived or is that an LNER IET in the left corner of that picture? xD


Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #29 on: July 11, 2020, 08:54:37 PM »
Well now, how did that get there?  ;)

Many thanks to jamespetts for merging the Class 222 into the pakset, it's ready to use.

Yes, I'm working on Virgin and Hull Trains liveries for Class 8xx.  After that I intend to model TransPennine Express' new Nova fleets, for any of you who miss locomotive-hauled stock...

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #30 on: July 11, 2020, 10:19:34 PM »
We have a major gap in trains in the pakset so its always nice to hear of new trains been worked on

Offline jamespetts

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #31 on: July 22, 2020, 12:46:55 AM »
Excellent, thank you very much for this: the darkened vehicles do look better. I have now incorporated this.

Offline thegamer7893

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #32 on: July 22, 2020, 04:36:20 PM »
Excellent, thank you very much for this: the darkened vehicles do look better. I have now incorporated this.

Nice stuff, however I would like to use these in a 3 car formation (similar to when operating the class 220/221 fleet) as the platforms at the stations on my map are too short for 4 car (the minimum length of the class 222) sets

Offline jonbridg

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Re: BR Class 222
« Reply #33 on: July 28, 2020, 12:08:23 AM »
It's not prototypical but I suppose it's physically possible. With this in mind I've decided to relax the constraints to allow a variety of formations (except 2-car as this makes the galley a pretty poor use of space). This could also implement an idea I've had to make the buffet useful: allow formations without one, but assign catering_level=4 to the buffet and demote the galley to 3, so that the full service is only available when the buffet vehicle is in the formation. This make sense to me as Simutrans applies catering to the entire convoy, like an 'average' catering level.