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Author Topic: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)  (Read 7590 times)

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Offline PlayTrans2009

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I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« on: August 29, 2009, 05:22:56 AM »
Oh whats the use. I cannot load pak128 forever. I tried to deleted pak64 files and still doesn't work. I tried to close all the programme but it is still not work.

:\ Oh well. Guess not to use pak128 again... ::(

EDIT: Although I can still use pak128.Britain. Sigh.

Offline Isaac.Eiland-Hall us

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2009, 06:00:10 AM »
We cannot guess what error you are getting.........

However, if you copied pak64 files into the pak128 folder, here's what I would do:

1. Extract a fresh copy of pak128 somewhere into a *temporary* folder
2. Delete all the simutrans/pak128 files
3. Copy the ones from your temporary/pak128 into simutrans/pak128

That way yo know you only have original files.

Then, add whatever addins you wish there (as long as they're for 128x128 ;) )

Offline PlayTrans2009

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2009, 06:10:05 AM »
So, I should delete all my pak64 files?

EDIT: Including my save files, addons?

Offline Isaac.Eiland-Hall us

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2009, 06:48:20 AM »
Man, you really got to tell us what's going on. You're making us guess at all of this.

Let's back up.

What, specifically, is going wrong?

Offline Dwachs

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2009, 08:07:10 AM »
So, I should delete all my pak64 files?

EDIT: Including my save files, addons?
The pak-sets reside in different directories/folders on your hard disk, i.e. simutrans/pak-xyz.

It is not advise to mix pak sets.

Regarding your pak128-problems, follow the steps Isaac suggested.

Offline PlayTrans2009

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2009, 11:18:12 AM »
So, you want ME to show you pictures? Ok, just for a while.

Offline Isaac.Eiland-Hall us

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2009, 11:32:02 AM »
So, you want ME to show you pictures? Ok, just for a while.

Let me explain how this works.

You did not pay money for Simutrans. Nobody here makes any money from this. Everyone here volunteers their time. Everyone here started out not knowing how anything worked, and we all figured it out - often with a little help from people already here, but that's the point.

Every time you ask a question, you're asking us to take our free time to answer. That's fine - that's one of the reasons we're here.

But when you don't give us any information to try and figure out what's wrong, you waste our time. When you make demands, we find it offensive, because it's like asking a stranger to do something for you.

So, yes. Take the time to describe your problems very well. Even better, take the time to search the forum, read other topics, read the wiki, and try to solve your problems that way first.

If you take the time to try and provide good information, to prevent us from having to guess, we're more than happy to try and help as best as we can.

Let me emphasize that: The more it's obvious you're putting effort into helping us help you, we're happy. The more it's obvious you won't search for yourself and won't take the time to describe what's going wrong, the less we want to help.

So please, help us help you. :)

Offline PlayTrans2009

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2009, 11:40:44 AM »
Ok, I will explain the whole thing.

I downloaded pak128 and then copy it to the normal "simutrans" file with my pak64. After loading, I started playing the game. I make a new map and click "Start Game". I waited until the loading bar goes 4/5. But then, the loading bar doesn't move in about one minute. I move my mouse to the taskbar and then, it froze. I click it then is non-responsive. >:( I click the exit button and the "end now" appear. I click "End Now". and I waited until it exit. After that, I delete my pak64, pak64 save file and reinstall pak128. I repeated the same thing but it was the same!

So, is that all I gave it?

Offline Isaac.Eiland-Hall us

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2009, 11:47:13 AM »
What do you mean by "normal simutrans file"?

You should have a simutrans folder somewhere. The pak64 files should be in simutrans/pak64. There should also be a simutrans/pak128 folder where the pak128 files go. Does that make sense? And does it match with what you see?

Here's another way to look at it: If you create a folder somewhere, and download the Simutrans exe zip, pak64 zip, and pak128 zip, and then extract them all to that folder - they should all put the files in the right place -- a "simutrans" folder should be created, and underneath that, the "pak" and "pak128" folders...

(Most paksets follow that convention for precisely that reason - to make it easy. But not all do, so you do have to check the zip first!)

Offline IgorEliezer br

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2009, 02:42:45 PM »
Topic renamed.

"Not again!" isn't a good topic title and doesn't show what the topic is treating. Please, use more meaningful topic titles that help everyone else.

Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2009, 07:08:46 PM »
I got supposedly the same error - program freeze near the end of generating map. It stops while generating last city with text like "City 37: number of iterations = 14" if I set 37 cities. I've got last Simutrans and pak128. Any ideas? :]

Offline Combuijs

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2009, 08:13:42 PM »
Hi Borek, welcome to the forum!

How big is your map? 37 cities might be a lot on a small map. Also, what's the number of factories and rivers you have set? Finally, what version of Simutrans do you use?

Offline prissi

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #12 on: November 06, 2009, 09:07:41 PM »
At the very end industries are placed, which could take some time, depending on the number of chains (and on simutrans version of course).

Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2009, 11:04:09 PM »
Simutrans release is 102.2, pak128 compatible with 102 and that's all I know. And wow, that was quite a fast response. Sorry for not saying hello yet. :D

I tried maps like 1024x1024 and 128x128 as well, number of cities, industries and attractions varying from 2 to 50. On pak64 all works really smooth (which is also incredible when I look back to versions about 89 or older :]).

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2009, 11:33:40 PM »
Well, if you tried a 1024x1024 map with 2 cities, 2 tourist attractions and 2 factories that should really work. That leaves either a strange number of rivers or there is something wrong with climates or there is something wrong with the pak itself.

Could you post a screenshot of your starting parameters (both windows)?

Your pakfile should come from a zip called "pak128-1.4.5--102.0.zip". Maybe you could redownload that file? Are you sure you put it in a clean directory, e.g. no previous pak was there?


Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2009, 11:59:49 PM »
Ok, here are the screens - first with options, second with the outcome (main window is freezed then). The file is ok, downloaded it few times already and never had a broken connection. I think this may be some issue between the newest Simutrans and pak file from May. To say the truth it is not my first problem with pak128, but it was always just some options/vehicles or other small things missing and now all I can do is play the "starting" map (this works really fine). ;]

Please tell me if somehow you can't see the images.

Offline DirrrtyDirk

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2009, 01:55:19 AM »
These screenshots are extremely small - it's almost impossible to see the settings on them. So, next time a little bigger would be nice...

To me it seems that "mountain height" is set quite high... 270 (or is it even 2700)? Try with a lower setting on that... let's say 160 or so...

And (just for testing) set number of rivers to 0.

Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2009, 08:51:50 AM »
Ok, rivers appear to mess something up, all works fine without them. So will this place be alright or should I (or someone else) post it in a proper topic?

And sorry for the images, forum won't allow them bigger than 200kb in summary and I don't know which format has better compression.

Offline DirrrtyDirk

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2009, 11:54:47 AM »
Well, for larger files we have created other solutions (since we didn't want to have large file attachments in the forum itself anymore)

You can put screenshots (files) either here:
http://simutrans-germany.com/files/index.php?lang=en
or here:
http://files.simutrans.us/
or (for screenshots only) you could use external picture hosters, like
http://imageshack.us/
for example...

Ok, now that we figured that the error has something to do with rivers, you could try and use a little different settings on these, i.e. make them shorter and see if that works. Again 270 might be a bit high for the mountains' setting, that might be the cause for the river problem, too...

And last but not least: the climate settings you use, seem a little extreme as well... 0-1-2-6-12-20... instead of 12 (or is that a 17 even?) and 20 I'd suggest you try something lower like 9 and 12 or probably even lower (since even with these, you might end up without having these climates on your map... OTOH if that's what you aim for, you can simply set them to "0")... so you might try 0-1-2-4-8-10... well, just play a little(!) with these numbers and generate a few maps to see what suits you best. Just remember: these numbers represent height levels on your map. Oh and the order of climates on your map in game is generated only through the numbers, it is not fixed like that list. So if you used, let's say 1-10-2-4-8-12, you'd end up with the tropical level between tundra and alpine levels on the mountains. Needless to say that this would look "a little" strange - but you can mix things up the way you like them... or by accident. But I wouldn't really recommend mixing everything up. Not everything that can be done also should be done. Keeping pretty close to the default settings is always the safest bet.

Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #19 on: November 07, 2009, 05:44:14 PM »
Thanks for the simutrans' file hosts, I don't like external image hosting much. ;]

So, I messed with "normalized" settings a little like you mentioned and added rivers one by one. This seems to increase generation time considerably. With no rivers generator works pretty fast and the other settings do not have that much impact - just as with the pak64. With one river (lenght from 20 to 100) it goes much slowe, with two even worse, with seven rivers it the process took about 10 minutes. I won't test how long it take to generate 16 of them.

So rivers don't really freeze the game, they just have got really heavy impact on the generation time.

Offline DirrrtyDirk

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2009, 06:27:10 PM »
Hmmm I just tried a map sized 1024x1024, mountain height also set to 270 with 16 rivers, length setting of 32/564... (no cities, industries or tourist stuff, though) and it took just a few seconds (with r2853).

Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2009, 06:31:57 PM »
Same here, even with industries and attractions all works well. Could this be some interference between cities and rivers? Looks strange to me, but I didn't read the code.

Offline DirrrtyDirk

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2009, 06:46:59 PM »
Ok, same as above but with 16 cities, 16 industry chains and 16 tourist attractions... it took just a few seconds longer. But no problems here... (but my climate settings are different - maybe that's part of the problem?)

Offline Borek

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2009, 06:51:29 PM »
I set the climate to normal and still nothing.

Offline DirrrtyDirk

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Re: I can't load pak128 (was: Not again!)
« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2009, 07:02:49 PM »
Sorry, I can't reproduce your problem (neither with 102.2 nor with r2853). It all works as it should here...