News:

Simutrans.com Portal
Our Simutrans site. You can find everything about Simutrans from here.

Crazy waiting times in Experimental from 30Dec

Started by steffen, January 04, 2011, 06:48:36 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

steffen

Hi,
First of all you've made some great progress, thanks for all the hard work :)
I'm playing the 32bit version now with the german pakset and I've encountered a little problem. Basically, every so often many - but not all - waiting times will go to crazy levels, ie. hundreds of minutes. In my new game the network is still very simple (4 horizontal trams, 1 vertical to connect them (and go a bit further); all of them are two tracks side-by-side to create an effectively bidirectional line) and the problem occured several times. I haven't been able to deduce any pattern or cause, I'm pretty sure it even happened at least once without any route/network changes. To workaround I can save&reload the game, which makes offering a savegame kinda pointless but obv I provide one if you want.
What can I do to help diagnose/fix this?

Cheers, Steffen

jamespetts

A saved game would be helpful, as I could run it for a while and see whether the problem recurs. How long does it normally take before the problem appears?
Download Simutrans-Extended.

Want to help with development? See here for things to do for coding, and here for information on how to make graphics/objects.

Follow Simutrans-Extended on Facebook.

steffen

Oh I forgot to mention, might be relevant, the connections between the the horizontal lines and the vertical one are on the same level, ie. they consist of 2*2 tiles junction.
I've got the autosave for October, and the problem happened in early November. How can I best get the savegame to you? It's 7 MB.

steffen

I've uploaded two savegames:
https://schaumburger.info/autosave01.sve
https://schaumburger.info/b1976-01.sve
The second save is a couple of game-weeks after the first one when the problem happened

Edit: You'll get a warning about the SSL certificate, ignore it, not relevant in this situation.

jamespetts

#4
Thank you for uploading the saves.  What do you mean by "they consist of 2*2 tiles junction"?

Edit: The saved game called "autosave" is from January. Which were the stops affected?
Download Simutrans-Extended.

Want to help with development? See here for things to do for coding, and here for information on how to make graphics/objects.

Follow Simutrans-Extended on Facebook.

steffen

Well the lines go like this:

-AB-
CXXC
DXXD
-AB-
So A is the southbound vertical tram, B the northbound one, and C/D are the west/eastbound horizontal tram. The Xs are junctions/crossings, where all for tram lines connect. Not sure if that explanation makes sense, but you'll see straight away what I mean in the savegame :)

I noticed the issue on all stops where I checked (checked 3 or 4), e.g. in Leipzig B6.

Edit: typo

jamespetts

Hmm, autosave01 is a Simutrans-Standard saved game. I'm presuming that you imported a Standard saved game into Experimental and then started noticing long waiting times?

After running it for about a year, I can't find anything untoward. Leipzig B6 is a very overcrowded stop: 300 or so unhappy passengers to 40 or so happy passengers. The waiting times to different destinations range from 11 minutes to 85 minutes. Long waiting times are to be expected when a stop is very overcrowded, since passengers have to wait a long time to board a vehicle that is not full. Are you sure that what you see is not simply a manifestation of overcrowding?
Download Simutrans-Extended.

Want to help with development? See here for things to do for coding, and here for information on how to make graphics/objects.

Follow Simutrans-Extended on Facebook.

steffen

Hm no it should be an experimental game. I haven't started standard in a long time, and the game window is titled "Simutrans 102.3 Experimental 9.1". I did use a height map, but that should affect savetype should it?
I don't understand where that huge amount of pax is coming from either, the maximum arrived/departed per month on that stop is 64 for me. I certainly never had anything even remotely approaching 300 at any stop in this game. Maybe my simuconf.tab affects it:
pak_file_path = pak.german-exp.20382/
use_timeline = 1
bits_per_month = 19
starting_year=1975
starting_month=1
citycar_level=0
passenger_factor=50
starting_money=50000000
autosave=3
station_coverage=4

factory_worker_percentage=0
tourist_percentage=0
passenger_multiplier=60
goods_multiplier=0

min_local_tolerance = 60

max_local_tolerance = 120

min_midrange_tolerance = 120

max_midrange_tolerance = 360

min_longdistance_tolerance = 360

max_longdistance_tolerance = 2160

tolerable_comfort_short_minutes=15

tolerable_comfort_median_short_minutes=120

tolerable_comfort_median_median_minutes=240

tolerable_comfort_median_long_minutes=480

tolerable_comfort_long_minutes=900


jamespetts

The arrived and departed figures show the passengers who have arrived and departed by means of your transport network. Look at the happy/unhappy graphs, which should show you the numbers of passengers who have been turned away because the stop was too crowded or because they had to wait too long. Incidentally, your passenger factor of 50 might explain the very high numbers: 50 is an extremely high passenger factor - the default is 16.
Download Simutrans-Extended.

Want to help with development? See here for things to do for coding, and here for information on how to make graphics/objects.

Follow Simutrans-Extended on Facebook.

steffen

Hm the combined happy&unhappy hasn't been above 50, with 8 convoys per month. The stop has a capacity of 256 so I don't think that's the problem.

Yeah I set a very high pax factor because I wanted to play a game where I would have to find ingenious ways to handle large traffic flows :)
I just forgot the game whilst chatting and my global pax carried dropped by over 80% (from ~2.5k) with no changes whatsoever (well, the trams that have 2 convoys may have "paired up", but that still doesn't explain this level of drop). In the last 7 months Leipzig B6 hat a grand total of 8 unhappy pax, with about 170 happy ones.
Leipzig B6 now shows the following wait times (all lie on the same line: "Leipzig B Bimmel" [Bimmel is Leipzig slang for tram]):
to B1: unknown
to B2/4/5/7: 4 to 8 minutes
to B3: 486 minutes

steffen

Oh btw do you hang around in any IRC channel or sth like that? Would make for a more convenient conversation :)

jamespetts

Having spoken to Steffen in IRC about this problem, it transpires that it was caused by running the 32-bit binary on a 64-bit Linux system, and upgrading to the 64-bit Linux binary of version 9.2 solved this issue. See here for further details.
Download Simutrans-Extended.

Want to help with development? See here for things to do for coding, and here for information on how to make graphics/objects.

Follow Simutrans-Extended on Facebook.

steffen

You already know from IRC ofc, but in case someone else runs into this issue: updating from x86-30Dec to amd64-4Jan fixes the issue. I'm not sure if the fix was due to the update, or due to changing from the x86-version to the amd64-version, but either way the problem is now fixed :)