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Author Topic: Bridges  (Read 67473 times)

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Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #140 on: January 31, 2012, 02:28:21 PM »
So I was playing recently with the elevated ways. Irritated at a big valley which needed crossing on the skew, I stacked up the diagonal elevated ways pont-du-gard style, resulting in a nice 5-high diagonal viaduct, very functional but a bit ugly. I then discovered that you can demolish the lower tiers, leaving just the upper tier looking more 'normal', albeit floating on air.

So I now wonder, is there any way we could have the bridge piers buildable in-game?. Probably at low cost, to allow us to tidy up such construction visually? Curved viaducts look really good in-game and are rather useful.


Offline ӔO

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #141 on: January 31, 2012, 03:00:39 PM »
So I was playing recently with the elevated ways. Irritated at a big valley which needed crossing on the skew, I stacked up the diagonal elevated ways pont-du-gard style, resulting in a nice 5-high diagonal viaduct, very functional but a bit ugly. I then discovered that you can demolish the lower tiers, leaving just the upper tier looking more 'normal', albeit floating on air.

So I now wonder, is there any way we could have the bridge piers buildable in-game?. Probably at low cost, to allow us to tidy up such construction visually? Curved viaducts look really good in-game and are rather useful.


on the japanese simutrans site,( http://japanese.simutrans.com/index.php?Addon128%2FRoadTools%201 ) there is a set of elevated roads with just the pillars, which is for stacking.
it should be possible to do that with the elevated ways I drew, since the pillars are full height.

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #142 on: February 03, 2012, 10:05:58 PM »
Sounds like a good idea - minimal cost and maintenance and 0 speed to prevent trains running on them.

Offline Fabio

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #143 on: March 24, 2012, 12:03:44 AM »
Here's a very interesting reading about bridge types. I wanted to share it, although many of these types are not possible / not nice with the current bridges code.

http://pghbridges.com/basics.htm

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #144 on: March 24, 2012, 01:53:45 PM »
Nice page, there are so many different trusses it's astonishing (they forgot the very useful Vierendeel truss, for instance.

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #145 on: April 02, 2012, 07:58:28 PM »
Bridge costs are now updated in SVN to more closely match the rail bridge costs. Do comment as necessary...

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #146 on: April 02, 2012, 09:29:21 PM »
Sounds like a good idea - minimal cost and maintenance and 0 speed to prevent trains running on them.
Yes, that sounds excellent.

Offline ӔO

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #147 on: April 02, 2012, 10:00:45 PM »
for the april 2nd nightly build
balance seems to be okay.

just 3 things I've noticed
steel truss railway bridge, "pillar_asymmetric=1" might be missing. Right now, the pillars from one side are too long.
iron lattice girder rail bridge, might be better with "pillar_distance=1" instead of 2.
concrete railway viaduct 225 might be in there twice.

otherwise, excellent work

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #148 on: April 29, 2012, 02:30:05 PM »
I am just beginning the process of integrating all of these into Experimental, and I have noticed that we appear to be missing the concrete elevated way, which is quite important in modern cities. Are there any plans to add this?

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #149 on: April 29, 2012, 04:34:57 PM »
Yes - I haven't done any more elevated ways yet - just bridges (see the to-do list)

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #150 on: January 05, 2013, 10:22:08 PM »
Time for some elevated ways. First up, an elevated way version of the wooden trestle rail bridge. I also took the opportunity to do better snow graphics for all wooden trestle rail bridges as shown in the second image:





Offline jamespetts

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #151 on: January 05, 2013, 10:24:54 PM »
Delightful!

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #152 on: January 05, 2013, 11:18:05 PM »

Love this image!  ;D

(wish we could get the piers to taper though...)

Edit: 3rd pier (counting from Left) - base seems too low. Graphical glitch? 2nd and 3rd pier should be the same length, no?

Offline greenling

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #153 on: January 06, 2013, 11:33:38 AM »
Very Cool.

Offline ӔO

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #154 on: January 06, 2013, 11:35:34 AM »
Love this image!  ;D

(wish we could get the piers to taper though...)

Edit: 3rd pier (counting from Left) - base seems too low. Graphical glitch? 2nd and 3rd pier should be the same length, no?

probably needs a line

I think it was pillar_asymmetrical=1

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #155 on: January 06, 2013, 10:00:18 PM »
@AEO - it already has that line. There are a few glitches in the bridge code I think. It's not the only bridge where you can see this, especially after rotation.

Anyway, here's some concrete rail elevated ways. The keen-eyed among you will spot two subtly different types with different speeds...


Offline jamespetts

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #156 on: January 06, 2013, 10:10:48 PM »
Very useful!

Offline ӔO

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #157 on: January 07, 2013, 09:45:35 AM »
very nice

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #158 on: January 07, 2013, 07:42:43 PM »
Nice indeed. :-) A bit too squaky clean, however, from my knowledge of pre-stressed concrete structures! Could they be painted so the grass underneath them goes brown?

Offline Bear789

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #159 on: January 07, 2013, 10:20:21 PM »
Looks good. However, that kind of full pillar will cause graphic problems when crossing diagonal ways on the ground. May I suggest to use a different kind of pillar, like the one used by Pak 64 elevated ways?
Like this ones: http://graphics.simutrans.com/displayimage.php?album=124&pos=11

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #160 on: January 07, 2013, 10:25:01 PM »
Actually, if the piers remain linear, can they have an arch through them? So when you double stack elevated ways, or build them along a road, the cars don't drive through the piers? Same goes for brick arches piers, they need transverse arches through the piers.

I keep seeing in game when a railway viaduct has been build directly along a road, it looks very wierd...

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #161 on: January 07, 2013, 10:33:25 PM »
I did consider that. Part of the problem is the bridge deck is narrower than the road. If you think it would look better with piers strutting out from the deck to make the arch that would work for the concrete ones, and for a steel/iron one I'm planning. However I don't think we have space for the transverse arches in brick pillars: in other words it's not the right type to use in that situation. And I've not seen too many of those either...

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #162 on: January 08, 2013, 12:07:13 AM »
Yeah, having googled some more, its not done often in masonry, because there's little point (unless there's something underneath...) and you can't make vastly wide openings, the Ouse viaduct has some of the best relieving arches I've seen - you could drive a bus through them if you were so inclined... (and had extended them to ground...), but i guess not a 2-way road.






Another example where it was done; Viaducto de los Quince Ojos (although that uses concrete, not true arches). You could get a road through them, though.

Offline greenling

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #163 on: January 08, 2013, 04:18:53 PM »
AP
Your Photo looks very gerat out.

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #164 on: January 13, 2013, 01:34:39 PM »
I've been thinking about this. I agree we need some elevated ways that look good when over the top of ground level ways. However I think the brick elevated ways should remain as they are - at least for rail - given how many of this type we have around in Britain and how few vaulted/cross-arched viaducts we have. I intend to draw an iron elevated way which will have four pillars on tile corners and I will redraw the concrete ones similarly - here's a quick preview (I've only done that one tile and not done any post-processing on the render) - does this work for you?


Offline greenling

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #165 on: January 13, 2013, 04:46:04 PM »
Woh
The new rail it the hammer. :o

Offline AP

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #166 on: January 13, 2013, 05:09:15 PM »
Looks good to me.

Can we have a steel version also (e.g. like the Liverpool Overhead Railway) to fill the 19th-century gap before mass concrete structures?

Regarding brick viaducts, if arches are not being added (fair enough) is there a way to prohibit the building of such a bridge along a road (only perpendicular to it)? I know level-crossings are orientation-sensitive, for instance...

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #167 on: January 13, 2013, 05:33:24 PM »
Unfortunately there is no way of the game knowing where pillars are at the minute, but I do plan on adding an iron/steel structure which will span roads sensibly. Now I've redone the High Speed tracks I will get producing some more elevated ways. I think doing it as a massive GIMP project and using kierongreen's updated and nicely aligned tracks will be the way forward rather than blender, for consistency. This will mean editing the existing brick elevated way quite substantially first however...

Offline jamespetts

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #168 on: January 14, 2013, 12:25:23 AM »
That seems to work for when there is a way underneath - pity that the game can't distinguish at present.

Offline Bear789

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #169 on: January 14, 2013, 02:05:53 PM »
That concrete el looks great.

Offline kierongreen

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #170 on: January 14, 2013, 05:19:33 PM »
A great pity I think could be fixed with an entry in the dat. I'll add it to my list of things to do when/if I get time!

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #171 on: January 14, 2013, 09:30:32 PM »
Latest progress - a range of arched elevated ways created from the existing one with a lot of fiddling around in the GIMP, and combining with kierongreen's new way graphics for extra consistency and perfect alignment of tracks :) I will do bridge versions for each to ensure graphical consistency - the pale on the top to replace the existing masonry bridge and the dark in the middle to replace the existing early brick viaduct.

Now the process is set up it's quite easy to recolour and change brick/track combinations. I intend to do something similar to create the concrete ways consistently.


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Re: Bridges
« Reply #172 on: January 14, 2013, 09:42:47 PM »
Very nice! Any plan to do something similar with aqueducts?

Offline greenling

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #173 on: January 14, 2013, 09:49:17 PM »
The Hood
The new bridge looks very good out.

Offline The Hood

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Re: Bridges
« Reply #174 on: January 14, 2013, 09:51:48 PM »
Very nice! Any plan to do something similar with aqueducts?

Not really - thought you were looking into doing those as part of your big canal project. I can send you the xcf file so you can see the method and use it if you like. In any case I don't see the same need for canal elevated ways - perhaps one or two but shouldn't need a range of speeds in the same way as rail.