The International Simutrans Forum

 

Author Topic: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus  (Read 1143 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline nuhgl

  • *
  • Posts: 43
  • Languages: EN, KR, SV
Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« on: November 17, 2017, 10:59:29 PM »


I have got very profitable Bus Line B with average speed calculated for 42.
And the Bus Line B Express with direct service. Its average speed is somehow calculated for 35, slower than Line B.

And for this reason, I am thinking that, no PAX is getting on-board on Express Line service at Greensmouth.
Instead they are waiting for Line B to CBD (Capital Stop) which is already becoming overcrowded. Thus increasing waiting time, journey time higher.

 :-[

What can I do to let PAX use my Express Service to regional capital Fleckly.

Here is link to save.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1nGyTZPFA-38Ma-r5bYqOXiwJndGGXMS8

Edit: How Average Speed is calculated?

Edit: I successfully increased average speed by removing some waypoints the express route have got quite many waypoints to route the bus on right track. And I am wondering why having non-stop, through waypoints reduce average speed of a line?
« Last Edit: November 18, 2017, 08:22:29 AM by nuhgl »

Offline jamespetts gb

  • Simutrans-Extended project coordinator
  • Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 18617
  • Cake baker
    • Bridgewater-Brunel
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2017, 01:57:53 PM »
Thank you for the report. One thing that I notice about the B Express line is that the 'buses have an extremely long wait at the Depot stop in Greenesmouth. Firstly, they have to wait about 5 minutes for the previous 'bus to leave, and then they have to wait another 10 minutes for their own scheduled departure time. This adds about 15 minutes to the journey between Nightingley and Varlton, and will therefore affect the overall average speed, which you will see on the graph (which, to answer your question, is calculated by dividing each journey time by its distance and averaging them; the actual timings used for passengers deciding where they want to go no longer use this general average time, but rather point to point average timings between each stop).

As to the waypoints, it might well be that the waypoints determine the direction in which your 'buses approach a 'bus stop, and therefore whether they have to queue for a long time between 'buses waiting for their schedule at that stop. This has the potential to make a very large difference to the timings.

Edit: I notice that passengers do take the B Express route between Fleckley and Cardean/Greensmouth, which suggests that the depot wait might well be part of the problem.

Offline thegamer7893 england

  • *
  • Posts: 780
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2017, 05:06:41 PM »
I've downloaded the save and it crashes. Why does it crash for me?

Offline nuhgl

  • *
  • Posts: 43
  • Languages: EN, KR, SV
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2017, 06:07:00 PM »
Thank you for the report. One thing that I notice about the B Express line is that the 'buses have an extremely long wait at the Depot stop in Greenesmouth. Firstly, they have to wait about 5 minutes for the previous 'bus to leave, and then they have to wait another 10 minutes for their own scheduled departure time. This adds about 15 minutes to the journey between Nightingley and Varlton, and will therefore affect the overall average speed, which you will see on the graph (which, to answer your question, is calculated by dividing each journey time by its distance and averaging them; the actual timings used for passengers deciding where they want to go no longer use this general average time, but rather point to point average timings between each stop).

As to the waypoints, it might well be that the waypoints determine the direction in which your 'buses approach a 'bus stop, and therefore whether they have to queue for a long time between 'buses waiting for their schedule at that stop. This has the potential to make a very large difference to the timings.

Edit: I notice that passengers do take the B Express route between Fleckley and Cardean/Greensmouth, which suggests that the depot wait might well be part of the problem.



Express B Line doesnt run between Nightingley and Varlton.
Here is diagram of Line B and Express B.

Express B starts its tour at Depot C then Greensmouth - Ulendon - Fleckly, returning Fleckly - Ulendon - Greensmouth. Then bus goes back to Depot C for precise departure time to minimise connection time from other lines at Greensmouth.

And I am servicing line with heaps of vehicles for possible traffic delay on route so It has enough buses to not to miss any scheduled departure time.
So at the depots there will be some buses already waiting. And journey to depot C for example for Express B is like Greensmouth - Depot C - Greensmouth, So it doesnt really have to take on PAX.

Waypoints are used to direct buses to approach bus terminal in certain directions to manage bus traffic flow at the town centre. But It might be the cause that brings down average speed significantly. Although, buses hardly wait or get stopped and be delayed at the waypoints.

Simply removing waypoints at schedule significantly increase average speed for the line. Thus, most of PAX prefer to take Express between towns now.
Travelling time between towns remains same.



New savegame https://drive.google.com/open?id=1XpOCN7phQhNClGfI5ttp8GoCDdtHUMqp

Offline nuhgl

  • *
  • Posts: 43
  • Languages: EN, KR, SV
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2017, 06:08:06 PM »
I've downloaded the save and it crashes. Why does it crash for me?

I run Simutrans 120.2.1 Extended Nightly development build 12.3 - raa0fc6b

Offline thegamer7893 england

  • *
  • Posts: 780
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2017, 09:31:00 PM »
Can you send it to me please? (not the save)

Offline jamespetts gb

  • Simutrans-Extended project coordinator
  • Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 18617
  • Cake baker
    • Bridgewater-Brunel
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2017, 09:34:37 PM »
You can download it on the Bridgewater-Brunel server.

Offline thegamer7893 england

  • *
  • Posts: 780
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2017, 11:12:06 PM »
K.

Offline jamespetts gb

  • Simutrans-Extended project coordinator
  • Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 18617
  • Cake baker
    • Bridgewater-Brunel
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2017, 10:59:47 AM »
Incidentally, in relation to the substantive issue: there is currently a feature in development which will allow a clear display of the point to point timings so that it is much easier to diagnose problems of this sort. That feature would also help to tell whether this issue is as a result of an error in the code or whether this is just the result of the way in which you have scheduled your 'buses.

Given that I am currently having to concentrate on completing the passenger and mail classes feature, it may be most efficient to wait until that new feature is completed and implemented before looking into this in any more detail, especially as that feature would significantly reduce the amount of time necessary to do so.

Offline thegamer7893 england

  • *
  • Posts: 780
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2017, 01:59:41 PM »
Ok

Offline NoMorePacers

  • *
  • Posts: 170
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2017, 04:58:06 PM »
Incidentally, in relation to the substantive issue: there is currently a feature in development which will allow a clear display of the point to point timings so that it is much easier to diagnose problems of this sort. That feature would also help to tell whether this issue is as a result of an error in the code or whether this is just the result of the way in which you have scheduled your 'buses.

Given that I am currently having to concentrate on completing the passenger and mail classes feature, it may be most efficient to wait until that new feature is completed and implemented before looking into this in any more detail, especially as that feature would significantly reduce the amount of time necessary to do so.

I thought that you were working on balance, but I have been on hiatus for 3 months so it probably has changed.

Offline jamespetts gb

  • Simutrans-Extended project coordinator
  • Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 18617
  • Cake baker
    • Bridgewater-Brunel
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2017, 08:33:54 PM »
I thought that you were working on balance, but I have been on hiatus for 3 months so it probably has changed.

I am working on balance - it is someone else, a new developer to Simutrans-Extended, who is working on the timings feature.

Offline NoMorePacers

  • *
  • Posts: 170
  • Languages: EN
Re: Slower Average Speed on an Express Bus Line than All-Stop Bus
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2017, 09:11:03 PM »
I am working on balance - it is someone else, a new developer to Simutrans-Extended, who is working on the timings feature.
That explains it then.