Airplane problems

[jarauh]

My airplanes tend to get stuck around airports. Somehow single tiles seem to be blocked (they are red when I push 'b'). I am not sure what the reason is, but it seems to happen if there are a lot of airplanes arriving at an airport and I either change the setup of the runways (i.e. I build a new runway and/or add a one-way sign to one of them) or if I add a new airplane or if I change the schedule. I can send some savegames to illustrate this problem. If I add new airplanes then mostly the airplanes in air don't land anymore but just circle around. If I change the runways, sometimes the airplanes don't accept the new runways and don't leave the ground anymore.
Workaround: Look which tiles are blocked, then remove them and rebuild them. If the airplanes get stuck on the ground, select an airplane, click on 'schedule', press escapt, then the airplane will move at least one tile forward. Iterate until all airplanes are free...

[prissi]

Use the nightly should help.

[Kgm13]

i have had this fault on the nighty before, maybe i just dont know how to use the planes?
i am an idiot after all ;p

[Colin]

Usually they only fly in circles if there is,
1. Another plane on the taxiway,
2. you only have one stop and it's occupied.
3. you have placed both stop signs in blocking positions so the plane can't find a taxiway.
4. there is a break in the taxiway. The most common of these is failing to join the taxiway to the runway.

Hope these help

[mroby]

I have run into this problem a lot lately.  I have made sure that none of the conditions exist which typically result in a problem (i.e. the four common airport problems listed by Colin). 

It seems the planes fail to "choose" to land and stop at an alternate "stop" if that makes any sense.  If there is one plane waiting at a stop - the other planes will circle until that one plane disembarks - at which time the rest will land. 

Is there anything I can do to explain this better?  I feel confused by my own description for some reason. . . maybe it's just Monday.  I don't like Mondays.

Thanks for the highly addictive game.

[prissi]

Screenshot or savegame may help for explaination. If too large, you can use http://files.simutrans-germany.com/ for a temporary storage (30 days or so) of your savegame.

[DirrrtyDirk]

Have you made sure that all the airport stops together just form one "station" (=is there just one or are there several name-signs on the airport?)

[mroby]

Prissi - I uploaded three screenshots to the German site.  They show a number of planes in a holding pattern waiting for the one at the gate to clear - even though there are plenty of open gates for them to use.   It's not until the one currently at the gate leaves that the next plane lands.

Dirk - I've made that mistake plenty of times - but no - it's just one station.  Thanks.

Thanks for your help!

Added these links:
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/simscr01.png
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/simscr03.png
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/simscr04.png

[DirrrtyDirk]

After looking at these pictures a couple of things come to my mind:

1.) Taxiways should not connect to runways in this way - at least in earlier versions, this was known to cause problems. So don't have taxiways run and continue into runways, use a 90 degree angle, preferably 1 tile from the end.

2.) Crossed runways usually aren't necessary. Most of the time just using one direction each is better.

3.) In your setup, departing aircraft have to taxi along the full length of the runway first, then turn around and take off - I'd build a longer taxiway instead.


Something like this one here:
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/airport.jpg

[mroby]

Awesome!  I will try it.  Thanks for your help.

[Frank]

...
Added these links:
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/simscr01.png
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/simscr03.png
http://www.simutrans-germany.com/files/upload/simscr04.png

included graphics in post with [ url=link][/url ]

[Colin]

This problem seems to be changing. I now have the problem where planes that are working properly suddenly start to circle at the start of the landing strip of a certain airport even if they have been landing there before. The only solution that I can use is,  destroy the landing runway only, rebuild it, using the same taxi way and it works fine. So, I press pause, rebuild the landing strip, press pause again and the planes start to land, even if there are a dozen or more planes waiting they will all land one after the other.

It seems that the planes stop recognising the landing strip.

[Ters]

Did you check if the runway was reserved? I just had a problem where airplanes started queueing up for landing and take off, without anyone actually doing either. I pressed b and saw that the runway was red, so I just manually cleared the reservation, and planes began taking off and landing again. The runway possibly got that way when I saved the game and continued playing.

[Colin]

Did you check if the runway was reserved? I just had a problem where airplanes started queueing up for landing and take off, without anyone actually doing either. I pressed b and saw that the runway was red, so I just manually cleared the reservation, and planes began taking off and landing again. The runway possibly got that way when I saved the game and continued playing.

Thanks Ters, I'll try that. I'm not sure why the runway would be reserved though with nothing actually on it, but I'll certainly give it a go. I just lost several thousand dollars because I didn't notice the planes going round and round.

OK, I've found that it happens every time I save the game and, it affects several airports. You were right it is clearable using the 'b' key but the fact remains, "there is nothing on the runway to cause it to be congested". This is definitely a bug, it's also a pain,  a player cannot get on with the game because he has to continually watch the map and this can be nigh on impossible with a large map.

[Dwachs]

@Colin: which version of simutrans are you using?

when does the problem occur? Directly after saving a game (while continue playing afterwards)? Or after restarting simutrans and loading the savegame?

Can you upload the an affected savegame please?

[Ters]

Although you asked Colin, I hope it's okay if I report my findings too, since the bug appears to be the same. I am using r4785. When I saved the game while an arriving airplane was on the runway, the reservation was not cleared when the airplane left the runway. When I click on the runway, the plane that just landed is still listed as reserving the runway. That plane was then afterwards able to use the same runway, and after taking off, it cleared the reservation.

My airport has a single runway with the typical two taxiways with one way signs near either end.

[Dwachs]

thank you, could reproduce that.

Edit: fixed with r4796.

[Colin]

Hi Dwachs, sorry it took me so long to reply. It seems Ters had exactly the same problem. I could not confirm what Ters said because I have so many, 25, airfields and possibly 20 planes flying around. I think Ters answer was right but I will try the latest revision. (when it's available that is?)
Many thanks for both your help.