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Author Topic: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work  (Read 29715 times)

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Offline IgorEliezer br

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Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« on: June 10, 2009, 05:09:18 PM »
Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work

We have a English Simutrans Wiki (http://en.wiki.simutrans.com) that explains the concepts and some philosophies of Simutrans and what each tool does, but a new player needs step-by-step tutorials that teach how to build and work with things of Simutrans.

Currently all Simutrans documentation is dispersed in various sites, and sometimes the wiki adopts a format that doesn't fit in a player who is knowing the Simutrans today. A player who discovered the Simutrans today will ask "what is the goal of Simutrans", "how to build a way" , "how to build a station" and other simple questions that we need to answer there.

Then, the Wiki needs DIDACTIC tutorials that DIDACTICALLY helps the player (example: Building a tunnel), like:

- Building your first good network
- Building your first passenger network
- Building your first mail network
- Building an airport
- Creating a line

Try to make tutorials from new player's view. If you were a new player, who never played Simutrans before, what you'd like to learn first? We want just simple tutorials with simple language, because that is the why we lose new players, artists and other collaborators.

Posts and texts that could be used and transferred to the wiki:

http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=782.msg7934#msg7934 (read whole topic)
http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=1726.msg17924#msg17924
http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?board=57.0 Tutorials board
http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?board=7.0 Help Requests board
http://docs.simutrans.com/ (this one has a lot of guides with tutorials for beginners and experts)
http://simutrans-germany.com/wiki/wiki/tiki-index.php?page=en_Devel_index (English texts in German Wiki - need to be ported to EN Wiki)
http://www.simutrans-tips.com/

:idea: People who wants to help can post here asking for an account in the Wiki, then they will be able to edit and improve our community Wiki. :D
« Last Edit: October 06, 2009, 11:42:44 AM by IgorTekton »

Offline whoami

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2009, 09:19:36 PM »
(Sorry, I still have little time.)

Regarding the German Wiki: Frank maintains it very well (together with a few more people), so he shouldn't be bothered to make it part of any reorganisation, similar goes for the manuals. In general, we should be careful with restructuring, and not get in the way of successful projects and productive contributors.

I forgot some more problems that I have with the Wiki (may apply to others, too):
- If no documentation exists for something, I have to construct the information from forum posts and observation of the game, i.e. my own experience.
- The writer doesn't have sufficient control over the stuff that he writes. This could be solved by assigning pages to maintainers.
- There doesn't seem to be a license for the (English) Wiki content, so it will be necessary to introduce one, to be sure that the contents are always free and available to the ST community, without restrictions. For screenshots and display of objects, it will be necessary to conform to the pak-set's license.

We could start a topic to organize an effort to revamp and complete the Simutrans Wikis.
Just tell us where, or we continue in this topic. ;)

EDIT: changed wording to reflect that the German Wiki is not Frank's personal Wiki; other people are invited to work on it.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2009, 10:33:10 PM by whoami »

Offline IgorEliezer br

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2009, 07:04:16 PM »
Just tell us where, or we continue in this topic. ;)

It's better a new topic, and its first post a list of things that need to be done and discussed. The main point is transferring English content from DE wiki to EN wiki. Other things will be discussed and solved along the way.

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2009, 01:32:24 PM »
I'm willing to work on the English wiki/

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2009, 04:06:49 PM »
I've written a more in depth wiki page on Paks, and made necessary links. Please edit as you desire.
http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/Paks

Offline Frank

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2009, 04:15:56 PM »
3. page

pakset links bottom this page http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/Simutrans_packages

and this page http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/DownloadPack

3 pages for one topic?

Offline vilvoh

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2009, 04:18:09 PM »
In addition, the correct term would be pakset, as pak makes reference to the pak file format too, so it might confuse people. I'm agree with Frank, would be better to improve an existing page before creating a new one.

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2009, 04:21:04 PM »
3. page

pakset links bottom this page http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/Simutrans_packages

and this page http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/DownloadPack

3 pages for one topic?

DownloadPack doesn't work for me and I think that the Simutrans Packages however needs more depth, and as it is a Guide it should be simple. However, I shall change the title to PakSet.

Edit: Done
« Last Edit: July 25, 2009, 11:48:10 AM by Maragil »

Offline LeifInge

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2009, 10:55:38 AM »
I think this is a good start, but there should be more written about each pakset, pros and cons, and pictures from them.

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2009, 11:08:09 AM »
Ok, I'll work on that. I can get screenshots for a few, but if anyone from the paks listed could please post a link to them, much appreciated. Also, I'd need some pro's and con's for others, as I haven't used them all.

Offline LeifInge

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2009, 11:57:49 AM »
For a long time the english wiki http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/Main_Page havn't been updated, so the quality varies a lot! If we could update it, then it would be a valuable source of information for old and espescially new players. In order to do this we need two things:
- people to actually write!
- and input on what information you would like to see on the wiki!

So use this thread to tell what you want to see on the wiki. I'll update this post with the suggestions, and hopefully it will be a good resource for getting a better wiki.

Suggestions
Pros and cons of Paks
Updating tips
More Guides



« Last Edit: July 26, 2009, 12:53:21 PM by LeifInge »

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2009, 12:49:04 PM »
I can write the English Wiki( I already am). However, the problem is as you say suggestions, however I'm am going to find Pro/Cons of paks , with screenshots. I think we need more of a guide for medium+ players, as our only good guide is that for newbies.I'll update the tips page a bit, but currently doing some blendering. (We could include that + Gimp on development page, with links to graphics.simutrans.com and some templates, if pak maintaners could give them.)

Edit:I'm going to write a page on Simutrans versions, i.e between Exp and Standard. If James Petts would like to help write some of it out, as I'm a bit woozy on that front.
Done

I've finished doing Pros + Cons on Paksets, going to copy+paste over some guides from the forums, and edit.(I've written one myself,but it's still being written.)

Edit2:PLEASE MAKE SOME SUGGESTIONS!

« Last Edit: July 26, 2009, 05:19:20 PM by Maragil »

Offline LeifInge

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2009, 12:59:16 PM »
Ok, I'll work on that. I can get screenshots for a few, but if anyone from the paks listed could please post a link to them, much appreciated. Also, I'd need some pro's and con's for others, as I haven't used them all.

Do we know which paksets which is actually working and maintained?

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2009, 01:43:19 PM »
pak64,pak128,pak128.Britain,pak192.comic,pak96.comic. That's all the ones I know. I've updated the Wiki page on Paksets with Pros and Cons of what I think are + and -. Please edit, especially for all others paks except for 64 and branches of 128(as well as 128)

Wikipedia is being stupid and not letting me upload images, so if anyone else would like to.
I'm going to write a page on Simutrans versions, i.e between Exp and Standard. If James Petts would like to help write some of it out, as I'm a bit woozy on that front.Done
« Last Edit: July 26, 2009, 07:53:40 PM by Maragil »

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2009, 08:49:18 PM »
As Myself and LeifInge are trying to update the English Simutrans Wiki, it would help very much if anyone can supply some Guides for the New/Advanced Player and above (i.e How to make your Transport Network better).


I myself have written one, however it's not the best. In theory, we could have several 'pros' with each of their own tips and suggestions on how to make an efficient Transportation Network. Please post either links or tips, and Credit shall be given. :D

Youtube videos only have a limited usability, so cannot cover everything :D

Offline IgorEliezer br

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #15 on: July 26, 2009, 10:23:07 PM »
Since Maragil, LeifInge, Whoami, Seth C Triggs, Hajo and Igor (me) have manifested the wish of revamping Simutrans Wiki - English, I'm preparing a topic where we will discuss and work on it.

Offline IgorEliezer br

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2009, 04:20:33 AM »
Well... I merged 3 topics and edited the first post. Now, this topic is called Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work.

Feel free to participate in our community work.

EDIT: READ 1ST POST FOR IMPORTANT INFO!
« Last Edit: July 29, 2009, 08:26:59 AM by IgorTekton »

Offline vilvoh

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2009, 06:27:40 AM »
@all: Perhaps you can get some ideas from simutrans-tips.com and the SRM guides at docs.simutrans.com. In addition, there're some excellent tutorials at PT board, written by IgorTekton, about basic issues like creating a service line, building an airport and an overview of the game called knowing Simutrans that can be used as an introduction to new players.

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2009, 07:53:13 AM »
Ok, Working on general stuff now.

Offline Michael 'Cruzer'

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #19 on: July 29, 2009, 09:59:45 AM »
There's amistake in pakset site.
Quote
PakGerman: 64x64 pixels, and the most challenging. PakGerman Homepage in English

Pros: Very Challenging , most consistent images. Pak64.19thCentury.Experimental (SIMUTRANS EXPERIMENTAL ONLY) Pak64.19thCentury.Experimental Thread

N.B: Requires Pak64 to run.

pak.german is a fully standalone pak-set. And pak64.19thCentury is an addon for standard pak64! Not for pak.german!


And pakHD isn't developed anymore and there is also no version which is compatible to any newer version! (The last version was 99.XX and isn't compatible to any actual version!)
So I think it would be better to notice, that you couldn't play it.

Offline Maragil

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2009, 10:45:49 AM »

There's a mistake in pakset site.
pak.german is a fully standalone pak-set. And pak64.19thCentury is an addon for standard pak64! Not for pak.german!


And pakHD isn't developed anymore and there is also no version which is compatible to any newer version! (The last version was 99.XX and isn't compatible to any actual version!)
So I think it would be better to notice, that you couldn't play it.

Sorry, problem fixed :D Problem in Wiki Formatting.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2009, 10:50:26 AM by Maragil »

Offline Spike

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #21 on: July 30, 2009, 02:50:38 PM »
pak64,pak128,pak128.Britain,pak192.comic,pak96.comic. That's all the ones I know.

pak.Hajo and pakHajo.Evolution both should run with Simutrans 102. From players view there is little difference, just some (slightly) improved texts and graphics in pakHajo.Evolution.

Edit:

Basically these make current Simutrans versions appear like Simutrans 0.84.16 or 0.84.20. They might be good for new players who want to get into Simutrans without being overwhelmed by a gazillion of way types, station buildings  and vehicles, or for those who like the old versions for nostalgic reasons.

Offline IgorEliezer br

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #22 on: August 01, 2009, 04:58:51 AM »
I've just split off some posts about new Simutrans logo: http://forum.simutrans.com/index.php?topic=2899.0

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2009, 07:49:20 AM »
I would like to help out with the Simutrans Wiki! ;D
Although I might not be the most active member o(._.)o  I'll try to enhance the wiki as much as possible! I've been around since... the 0.88 stable version or slightly before :D

Edit: why does it seem that my posts have disappeared a few times already... i've had to remake my forum account before too :\
« Last Edit: August 04, 2009, 07:54:56 AM by krazywrath »

Offline whoami

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2009, 10:09:48 AM »
Edit: why does it seem that my posts have disappeared a few times already... i've had to remake my forum account before too :\
AFAICT, they haven't been deleted (I can't see any in the "recycle bin"). Are you sure you actually have saved them, and did not just press "preview" or "spell check"? What timeframe did you post in?

krazywrath

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #25 on: August 06, 2009, 08:26:02 AM »
Timeframe.... maybe say around 1-2 years ago.

Offline Spike

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #26 on: August 06, 2009, 09:33:50 AM »
Timeframe.... maybe say around 1-2 years ago.

Then your posts are most likely in the archive of the old forum (I don't remember the URL right now ...)  A while ago we had to move the forum to a new server and all former messages went to the archive in this process.

This also explains why your account was lost. This is a new forum, basically.

krazywrath

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #27 on: August 06, 2009, 09:47:55 AM »
ohh alright!! ;D
I hope there's no more forum moves.. >.>

Offline Dirk Burkholz

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #28 on: August 12, 2009, 06:14:49 PM »
I would like to help out with the Simutrans Wiki! ;D
I'm sorry, I overlooked this! Which username do you want?

Offline IgorEliezer br

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work (@ Frank and DE Wiki)
« Reply #29 on: August 16, 2009, 05:22:16 AM »
Frank, or someone else in charge of DE Wiki, could you kindly post here the links of all pages of DE Wiki that are in English?

We are creating pages in EN Wiki for them.

Thanks

Offline Frank

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #30 on: August 16, 2009, 06:53:30 AM »
« Last Edit: August 16, 2009, 07:16:38 AM by Frank »

Offline Raven

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #31 on: August 18, 2009, 06:15:10 PM »
Hi lads, since I'm relearning all the basics regarding makeobj and such, it'd be little hassle for me to pass that information onto the .en wiki.

Problem is I don't have a clue which e-mail address is linked to my old "Raven" account. Nor the yahoo, nor the hotmail, and definitively not the gmail or the one from my co.

:·/ I'm at a loss here.

Offline Frank

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #32 on: August 18, 2009, 06:28:35 PM »
@Rojo

The Tikiwiki on simutrans-germany.com is a new install in 2007.

This has nothing to do with the first Tikiwiki to do.

The english Mediawiki is the successor of the english Tikiwiki.

In Tikiwiki you can register your self. For english Mediawiki create a admin a account for you.

Offline Raven

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #33 on: August 18, 2009, 06:35:28 PM »
Hi Frank,

thanks for the info.

Because of wiki parts like this:

http://en.wiki.simutrans.com/index.php/Urban_Renewal_64

(Check history of that one)

I just recalled I did have an account there (Raven)

But trying to log in with my usual passwords doesn't get me trough.

I've also tried sending me an e-mail, but I don't receive it. Anywhere



EDIT: I'm thinking I had an account on .simutrans domain, but the changes, the other forum lost... I think I did have the address somewhere there (in a private message from Isaac).

BRB

Offline mobo

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Re: Revamping EN Simutrans Wiki - community work
« Reply #34 on: August 18, 2009, 06:49:39 PM »
The  german tikiwiki is the most up to date one for pak development (also in english). And it can be edited without logging in.

http://simutrans-germany.com/wiki/wiki/tiki-index.php?page=en_dat_Files

Edit: maybe a bit awkward to tell this in this thread (read the topic afterwards). Sorry. The english wiki tries focusing on the player more which is also good players are plenty  :) So it helps more people than te other one, phew i hope that does it ;)
« Last Edit: August 18, 2009, 06:58:39 PM by mobo »