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Offline gauthier

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buses make turning
« on: November 11, 2008, 06:31:23 PM »
Simutrans pak128 (I can't remember the version of pak), 100.1 r2086 SDL

Normally, the bus must take the green shedule and it takes the red one.

The bus you see on the arrival has arrived by the red shedule but it's leaving.

Offline prissi

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2008, 09:14:56 PM »
There is one curve less, since it must not turn around. There is a penality in the pathfinder for turning around. Just like real life.

Offline gauthier

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2008, 10:08:36 PM »
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Just like real life.

 ???

Offline prissi

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2008, 10:25:55 PM »
Usually a bus do not makes U-Turns at stops but tries to continue straight ahead.

Offline gauthier

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2008, 02:53:40 PM »
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Usually a bus do not makes U-Turns at stops but tries to continue straight ahead.

It's what I told you. It's a problem because I lose money ! It's not really easy to make profit  :'(

Offline prissi

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2008, 03:25:10 PM »
It is not a bug report, since this is the intended behaviour. You can make extension requests, but I do not considerer this a bug.

Offline robofish

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2008, 05:31:52 PM »
on the picture it looks as if the bus has already done a u-turn in the station (because he is on the right side, as if he came along the green marked path).
This is not intend if I understand your explantion right. At the moment it drives around the block first and than makes a u-turn in the station, instead of following the green-marked path an pass the station straight.
BTW I've recognized similar behaviour in some of my savegames too.

Offline jbode

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2008, 05:35:27 PM »
If you want to force the green path: use a waypoint in between.

Jörg

Offline gauthier

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2008, 06:06:32 PM »
All vehicles have to drive on the shorter path, so I consider it as a bug.

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If you want to force the green path: use a waypoint in between.

I haven't to do this normally.

Offline prissi

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2008, 08:46:03 PM »
Short is defined as the fastest way, i.e. the way with lees tiles a turns. The red way is two tiles longer but had one turn less. Thus, it is shorter to drive.

Offline robofish

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2008, 09:39:50 PM »
The red way is two tiles longer but had one turn less.
Am I silly? I count 2 turnes on each route.

@gauthier
could you please show/tell us where the next stop is? (in which direction)
=> whould the bus have to make a u-turn in the station if it drove along the green path?

joecz

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2008, 12:08:19 AM »
as prissi has already pointed out, the u-turn in the station counts as a turn.
it is intended behaviour and therefore imho no bug

Offline z9999

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2008, 06:51:42 AM »
Hmm.. even if it is not a bug, feeling strange is understandable.

Offline ML

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2008, 01:51:54 PM »
Simutrans 100.1, 2092, pak128

I have many tram linies in my city, which crossed. I have read the replies in above this topic and - if I understand -, the bus goes still in its straight direction (not to rotate 180° in stations) and it tries to make least turns. As you can see on the pictures, the tram line stops in all three stations. In my opinion it should go via green marked tramlines, but it goes via red. I tried to change the curves on my track, but it still goes via red.

I dont understand why it goes through red, when:
  • it is more curved
  • it must turn 180° in the station

   

Offline Dwachs

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2008, 03:45:15 PM »
the green line makes an S-turn. You can force the trams by using one-way signals (from the railway menu).
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Offline gauthier

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2008, 06:21:34 PM »
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as prissi has already pointed out, the u-turn in the station counts as a turn.
it is intended behaviour and therefore imho no bug

It's not normal, and as there are less or more turns, there are mor tiles by U-turn.

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could you please show/tell us where the next stop is? (in which direction)

The next stop is on the North.

Offline robofish

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2008, 09:46:52 PM »
The next stop is on the North.
So the bus has to make a U-turn in the station currently.

That means that the current (red) route has the same number of curves (2) is longer than the green route PLUS forces a U-turn in station. This means it's not the best route, which means it's a bug IMHO.

(sorry if I sound rude that is not intended)

Offline prissi

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2008, 10:23:00 PM »
I checked the code and I had removed the U turn penalty long ago. So I was wrong.

But the code has also another problem, which is not really solveable. It has diffrent values for 45° and 90° curves. Since you are starting on a tile directly before a curve, it will result in a 45° curve and a 90° curve. The other will have two 90° curves. There is little that can be done about it, since the curvature of the last and the first tile cannot be calculated properly and must be guessed. (Since you need the previous and preprevious tile to check whether 45° or 90° bowing; but the preprevouis one is not available on the first tile.)

So in this situation you are stucked with waypoints.

Offline VS

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2008, 10:43:28 PM »
In other words, one more tile and it would work?

That isn't too bad ;)

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Offline prissi

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2008, 10:45:57 PM »
Any stop directly in front of a turn has this problem. But it shows seldomly, thus people do not notice it. This is the price to pay for A* routing with the current metric.

Offline robofish

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Re: buses make turning
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2008, 11:01:55 PM »
thanks for explaining :)