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Author Topic: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here  (Read 25084 times)

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Offline moblet

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Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« on: August 15, 2011, 01:04:15 PM »
Game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk will be uploaded soon.

It runs r4359 (110.0.1 stable) with openpak128 nightly, same as for game #1 and also as used on server 128.simutrans.entropy.me.uk.

The pak can be downloaded here: http://entropy.me.uk/simutrans/simupakopen128-1150.zip

This server is accessible via both IPv4 and IPv6.

This game will be played using a set of territories and rules, see them here.

All players in this game have been locked. To join the game, post in this thread and a game admin will send you a password by PM. When posting, say which territory you would like and whether you want to move goods, passengers/mail, or both. You can also request a player colour if you wish (you can view these in the player list in the game).
« Last Edit: August 15, 2011, 01:33:29 PM by moblet »

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2011, 02:22:01 PM »
I am confused. No reply in this thread yet, but obviously 7 players are playing heavily. What did I misunderstood...?

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2011, 02:29:26 PM »
The new game has not been started yet. If you are looking at a well developed game it will be the old game #1. Timothy plans to upload it later, but I will be asleep then so I have posted this now.

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2011, 02:34:33 PM »
Ah, so I am watching the old game. Sorry for the buzz. Some questions:

- Will the server be shut down at night?

- Is it possible to found teams? If yes, I'd rather like to join one.

- Is there any aim to reach? When will the game end?

I like the map and the rules, especially collaboration and realism. My problem is time. Feeling responsible for an online territory sucks time. That's why I am asking in that way.

Offline Guillaume

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2011, 02:41:59 PM »
Hi,
There's no aim to reach  ;)  Or maybe one : enjoy playing !
The game will end when Timothy will upload the new map, because the current one was a test for rules, players and map.
But in the future, a game can end if the map become unplayable, if there's too much industries,... Or if nobody play it anymore.
I don't know what you mean by team, but all players on the same map are in the same team  ;) Maybe we can say there's another goal :
Co-operate with others.
The server will never shut down, except for problem, uploading of a new map,...

Your problem is time, we have all the same problem : I'm working on a map, 640x640, it's big, but with a lot of players, you'll administrate a territory, and you can choose to do freight and/or passengers, passengers will need less time I think  ;)

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2011, 02:49:16 PM »
Guilllaume, thanks!

Fore sure all players will form a team, somehow. We did it in the same way at the first tests last year.
I like that way of playing.

Next questions:

- Are you usually sharing passwords to avoid problems in time of absence?

- Can you tell some details about the config, especially critical things like overcrowding, private traffic, a.s.o.?

BTW: I looked half an hour on that map and only now I recognized Switzerland. ; - )

Offline Fifty

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2011, 03:05:13 PM »
Hello Rainer,

All of the admins have all passwords that are needed for administration. We all live in different time zones, so one of us is almost always awake, if not online.

Config: (Moblet, correct me if I'm wrong)
-No city cars
-city growth reduced to 5%
-(perhaps) industry_increase_every increased from 5000 to 6000-8000.
-standard overcrowding settings (no modifications from standard settings)

I think what you mean by teams is that 2 people could share one player in one region. I would be very happy to do this with someone, particularly if someone wants to do pax in the same region I do freight. I think this might work well; we could at least try one region with a team.

Offline Guillaume

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2011, 03:06:26 PM »
In the previous game, only moblet and me were sharing passwords  ;) On the current, we're not really playing moblet and me, it's a test.
I hope that in the future we'll share passwords, it's very useful to fix problems like : too much trucks on this line, not enough here,..., or to solve our nightmare : the traffic jams.
From my experience : traffic jams were a nightmare, but we solved the problem ( not on the current map ) : by deleting cars  ;)
Overcrowding is good at start, but when you've to manage 2 millions people, it's impossible ( This was my main problem on the previous game), so I think to set a limit of population for all cities ( not the same, depending of landscape, industries,...), is it a good solution ?
« Last Edit: August 15, 2011, 03:10:36 PM by Guillaume »

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2011, 03:08:42 PM »
Sorry, I was'nt clear enough. I did not ask about admins. Next try:

At your server, do the _players_ share their passwords usually?

We did that in our test games. If someone is absent, but in his erea something is going wrong, which affects the entire game, a coworker can fix the problem. That's what is is about.

[edit] Guillaume was faster. Thanks. ; - )

[edit] Ok, I would like to give it a try. Give me the territory/job you prefer.

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2011, 03:14:57 PM »
- Will the server be shut down at night?
No, like all online games the game will continue to run 24/7.
- Is it possible to found teams? If yes, I'd rather like to join one.
We are at a very early stage and still experimenting with principles and rules. Formal teams is an interesting idea and one we can try in a future game. Can you tell us how your teams worked before? In the meantime there is nothing to stop you sharing your password with one or more others and having your player operated by more than one person.
- Is there any aim to reach? When will the game end?
Not yet, just to develop the map and co-ordinate with the other players. Feel free to make suggestions.
I like the map and the rules, especially collaboration and realism. My problem is time. Feeling responsible for an online territory sucks time. That's why I am asking in that way.
I hear you! These games need to be playable by people with limited time. We have tried to turn off city cars and slow the city growth rate by 95% and also the industry growth rate for game #2, I hope we have succeeded. In any case we will use these slower growth parameters in building future maps. Otherwise I think our config parameters are the default values, just_in_time is on, routing overcrowding buttons are off, if you have recommendations for parameters please share them.

Our three admins, who are in different time zones, can act as the public player and intervene to change your infrastructure in your absence. In this game we can also identify each player in the forum, so if something is going seriously wrong with your player we can send you a PM to inform you. If you like the rules and co-operative play, then we want you in the game and will help you as much as we can. We would like to build a culture on this server where players would share their passwords in that way, but it is new, this is only game #2. On the other multiplayer servers I have seen, many players are locked in direct competition and sharing passwords is not part of the culture. In the meantime feel free to place a sign at the opening scene, post, and/or PM the admins your password to check and maybe fix anything you are concerned about.

Guillaume, I tried to delete city cars on this map, we will soon know if I succeeded...

Offline Xelofino

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2011, 04:07:35 PM »
This sounds very interesting to me. I would really like to give it a try. Two problems. First of all, the same as rainer has, not much time. At the moment i'm still in holidays and can't access Simutrans very soon (just about 18th). And at 21th School starts so then time will be rare. Second problem is, that i mostly just play with pak.german. But i think if someone just explains me a bit the balancing, the history or the best way to start in pak128 i would give it a try. If rainer is really unsure about participating than i would even cooperate with him, and play as one company (if he wants to).
Some Questions : Why did you make such huge Cities at the start of the game? Who chose these crazy citynames?  ;D and Is that yellow thing the motorway which can only be accessed at these exits?

If i play, i choose North, Passenger/Mail.

Xelofino

Offline Guillaume

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2011, 05:05:38 PM »
I think I want to operate the South, both passengers and freight.
Xelofino, these cities are not very huge  ;)
On this map moblet choosed the names.
Yes the yellow thing is old taxiways protecting motorways from players and cities.

Offline Vonjo

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2011, 07:21:36 PM »
I think I want to play West. Freight, passanger, or both is ok.
However, as another player here, I usually only have a little time (few hours) to play a day.
Whatever colour.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2011, 07:36:19 PM by Vonjo »

Offline Xelofino

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2011, 07:35:24 PM »
Few hours, little time? I have (in best case) 2 hour/day but in worst case nothing. Average 30 minutes to 1 hour. This time is about 19 o clock to 21 (GMT +2 if i'm right). I think i will give it a try and take north as i said before and just ppassengers/mail. Could somebody make a realllyy short summary in p.s (2-3 sentences) about how i should play pak128? Just to know the structure. I will surely make a testgame for me and try things out but more advanced players could give me hints that i don't have to begin at the start. I would be glad :)

Xelofino

P.S: When does it start? (Servergame and ingameyear)

Offline Fifty

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2011, 08:51:22 PM »
The game will start in real life as soon as Timothy Restarts the server.

Game time, the server will start in 1930, but obey era/timeline is off (all vehicles can be purchased).

@Vonjo, may I ask what your nick has been in prior netgames (if you have played)?

@Xelofino, I am no expert, but here is what I can say about pak 128. It is quite different than pak.german. In the german pak, running costs are quite high and maintenance is quite low. In 128, maintenance costs are quite high and running costs quite low. All of your convoys can turn a profit and you can still go bankrupt. In pak.german, there is no speedbonus. In 128, speedbonus is very important for passengers, mail, and many finished goods. In 128, you can make lots of money and impressive margins of 70-80%, but starting is much harder. There are some buses and trains that are better than others, just look at the netgames to see the ones people use. For the most part, diesel and hydrogen trains are best for freight, and electrics for passengers. If this is your first time playing 128, you might want to experiment on the other 128 server a bit first to see how to best start a game. I usually start with fast trains on slow tracks for freight or pax to upgrade track later, or with small bus networks.

I would like to play East, Freight only. If someone wants to partner with me to do pax and supervise the network that would be great.

Please let us know definitively if you want to play and what/where you would like to do so we can send you the password and you can start playing once the server is restarted!

Offline Vonjo

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2011, 09:10:55 PM »
EDIT : Sorry. Double post delete this.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2011, 09:22:17 PM by Vonjo »

Offline Vonjo

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2011, 09:17:00 PM »
@Vonjo, may I ask what your nick has been in prior netgames (if you have played)?
I was on 128.entropy server as purple from savegame 18 april to 31 may.
Was on 64.entropy server too twice but i'm forget. usually as purple too.
Whether you believe me or not...

http://entropy.me.uk/simutrans/networksavegames/sim128/
« Last Edit: August 16, 2011, 01:54:42 AM by Vonjo »

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2011, 05:38:53 AM »
Why did you make such huge Cities at the start of the game?
Because of the constraints of the territories and the choice of transport task (goods vs pax), and because different players have different preferences and different amounts of time available, we wanted to make a map that could suit all these different players at once, and for which it is possible to make a profit on passenger service from the very beginning.

Timothy has loaded the map but the server is not responding at present. I have sent him a message to let him know.

Offline Xelofino

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #18 on: August 16, 2011, 05:59:22 AM »
Ok, i understand. You know, im very fixed, that in pak.german you start with tiny villages which grow extremly fast but here it is totaly inversed.

I want to participate, North, Passenger/Mail, Colour:Blue or green.

Only problem as i said before, i will only be able to start playing on 18th. If this is too late than you can give my place to someone else  :).
@Fifty: Thanks for the Summary. I will try to start bankruptless :P.

Xelofino

Offline Ashley

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #19 on: August 16, 2011, 07:58:00 AM »
New map should be online now, let me know if the server is still not responding. Sometimes when starting up the game hangs when loading the map.

Offline Vonjo

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #20 on: August 16, 2011, 08:16:17 AM »
Quote from: moblet (in game)
yes, but i think we should make vonjo choose either goods or pax
as both would be a big task
Goods first. :)

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #21 on: August 16, 2011, 08:36:16 AM »
Thanks Timothy, the server is working now.

Xelofino and Vonjo, you have both been sent passwords by PM to join the game.

The territory assignments are:
North
Pax/mail: Xelofino
Goods: free
South
Pax/mail: Guillaume (as SNCFS & Freight)
Goods: Guillaume (as SNCFS & Freight)
East
Pax/mail: moblet (as Mobilet)
Goods: Fifty
West
Pax/mail: free
Goods: Vonjo

We currently have two spaces remaining for players to join.
rainer, tell us which remaining territory/task combination and colour you want and we will send you a password to join the game.

When setting your player name, consider placing a tag so other players can see your task from the player list (e.g. W pax for "West passengers & mail")

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #22 on: August 16, 2011, 11:08:46 AM »
rainer, tell us which remaining territory/task combination and colour you want

I don't care. Just give me a job. ; - )

Offline Guillaume

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #23 on: August 16, 2011, 11:18:44 AM »
We will not choose for you, choose and then play  ;)

Offline yoshi

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #24 on: August 16, 2011, 01:08:40 PM »
I want to take North and operate freight services.

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #25 on: August 16, 2011, 01:26:06 PM »
Yoshi has now been assigned player 8 to transport freight in the North territory.
rainer has now been assigned player 7 to transport passengers and mail in the West territory.

All places in this game are now filled. If anyone leaves the game their place will be made available to a new player.

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #26 on: August 16, 2011, 03:30:08 PM »
Went in the game. Logged in at Player 7. Can't do anything. Am I aysnchron? No error message, nothing...

[Edit] Ok, I am not asynchron, but have an unacceptable delay. Unplayable so far.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2011, 03:47:46 PM by rainer »

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #27 on: August 16, 2011, 03:47:16 PM »
Try restarting Simutrans now and seeing if it works. It's possible my installation was locking you out, as I hadn't restarted Simutrans since setting your password.

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #28 on: August 16, 2011, 03:57:02 PM »
Ok, restarting reduced the delay from 2 or 3 minutes to some 10 seconds. Anythings else I can do?

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #29 on: August 16, 2011, 03:58:47 PM »
So it's a lag problem you're having? Are you on Linux?

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #30 on: August 16, 2011, 04:01:19 PM »
Linux version 2.6.32-5-686-bigmem (Debian 2.6.32-31)

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #31 on: August 16, 2011, 04:03:26 PM »
I had major lag using the Linux version on Ubuntu, I believe this is normal. The Windows versions don't lag much but are more prone to desyncs. Are you able to use a Windows version? Keep both the GDI and SDL versions handy and use whichever is better behaved on the day.

Offline rainer

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #32 on: August 16, 2011, 04:06:47 PM »
Are you able to use a Windows version?

No way.

Sorry folks, it was an interesting test, but for me it has its end here.

@all: Have fun in the game!

Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #33 on: August 16, 2011, 04:15:57 PM »
OK, sorry you had problems, and thanks for trying. I don't know if any of the tech experts have any ideas on why the Linux version has lag issues.

This means that West passengers & mail is available if anyone wishes to join the game.


Offline moblet

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Re: Join game #2 on moblet.simutrans.entropy.me.uk here
« Reply #34 on: August 18, 2011, 06:13:13 AM »
Ok, restarting reduced the delay from 2 or 3 minutes to some 10 seconds. Anythings else I can do?
What spec machine are you running? Vonjo runs Linux and says it lags if he runs it on a slower machine (e.g. P4), which is what I was doing also.